From last night's bullshit: Thoughts on Hermes and consumerism

[chironcentaur]

It truly is amazing what you can say that starts shit on the internet. Its also amazing the way two people can twist everything you say around until you sound like the biggest asshole on the planet.

It started when I made an innocent comment that, while I won't argue that Hermes is a god with connections with technology and the internet, I don't

Comments

[bluedolfyn]

Er, yeah. I stand by my "people are stupid and they suck."

In my experience, more with Odin than with Loki but to an extent with them both, they often give you what you expect. That is, if they're not invested in you -- if you aren't theirs -- and you expect something shallow, something petty, something . . . I dunno. Less? -- well, then, that's what you get, because you don't deserve to see their depths. I dunno if Hermes is like that. I *do* know that a lot of people see connections between Odin and communication and writing and the internet and technology, but I'm not sure anyone gets the image of cell-phone-wasting, must-have-all-the-gadgets Odin in their heads. I also know that a lot of people see a lot of similarities between Odin and Hermes, but I also think that Hermes gets treated a bit more lightly than Odin does. I'm not entirely sure why? Heh. I'm not sure that *anyone* anyone sees similarities with Odin should be treated lightly at all. (Er. My "squishy snuggly teddybear of death" comments not withstanding. That's different. It's Pops, after all, and . . . uh.)

I'm sorry people suck. :o(

[chironcentaur]

In my experience, more with Odin than with Loki but to an extent with them both, they often give you what you expect. That is, if they're not invested in you -- if you aren't theirs -- and you expect something shallow, something petty, something . . . I dunno. Less? -- well, then, that's what you get, because you don't deserve to see their depths.

Hmm...you know, I have noticed that the image of Hermes seen by those strongly touched by him (those I know and whose opinions I respect) is starkly different than what is reported by those who know him only casually. I have wondered why that is, why Hermes seems darker, more serious, than what other people claim. At the risk of sounding arrogant, I do think you may be on to something.

but I'm not sure anyone gets the image of cell-phone-wasting, must-have-all-the-gadgets Odin in their heads.

Too busy attraction the chest thumping uber macho mighty arm chair warriors? Although, whatever the reason, it is nice to see people can draw connections between a modern thing and a deity without being ridiculous about it.

I also know that a lot of people see a lot of similarities between Odin and Hermes, but I also think that Hermes gets treated a bit more lightly than Odin does. I'm not entirely sure why?

Well, Hermes doesn't have the battle berserker side like Odin, doesn't have the murderer and apocalypse bringer label that Loki does. I guess his connections with thieves and con artists don't scare people, and his association with the other forgotten. Plus there is the general trend in much of the Hellenic community to only see the gods as examples of unquestioned perfection that are only connected with the best of life and have nothing whatsoever to do with what you think of as negative. Yeah I get that he's friendly and likes people and all that, and he's often helpful, but that's no reason to see him as being completely defanged. I don't know him as a relentlessly nice, sweet, harmless being that coddles humanity.

"squishy snuggly teddybear of death"

LOL! I believe Renee referred to me like that once. :-P

[bluedolfyn]

I don't think it sounds arrogant. As individuals, *we* wouldn't bother wasting our time and energy exposing deeper parts of ourselves to people who are uninterested; accepting that the gods, too, are individuals, why would they also be bothered or willing to do that? Especially with people who latch on to the whole "Loki is cool, yay chaos and poor behavior yay!" idea and completely miss the part of being a catalyst is because change needs to happen, is because stagnation is bad, and it's not necessarily about the chaos or disruption so much as that it's a tool to bring about the change. Nevermind the people who don't even treat them as real. Have we told you about the East Coast Thing year, with the problem with people harrassing the Lokeans, threatening to burn down the Loki ve, and then everyone treating the falling over of the Frigga ve as if it was just because of the windstorm? Never mind that that ve was a nice wood-and-canvas sturdy tent and that the Loki tent was a barely held-together, light-weight little thing that did not knock over. No, but no message there. Oh, no. Frith wasn't broken or anything, no....

I do suppose the berseker battle side to Odin does help keep him from being seen as lightly as people seem to take Hermes. I still don't get it. I see enough commonalities between the two that no way, no how would I take him lightly. Then again, Apollo gets the same treatment, and as I've been threatened by him (it was a bad couple of years, I was horrible to Poseidon, I totally deserved it and needed it even) I know better than to see him as all happy and light and sun and yay!

Bah. Like I said, I'm standing by the people are stupid comment.

[chironcentaur]

with the problem with people harrassing the Lokeans, threatening to burn down the Loki ve, and then everyone treating the falling over of the Frigga ve as if it was just because of the windstorm?

"Are those Lokeans over there setting up a ve for Loki? What are they thinking? This is a gathering of decent folk, we can't be introducing something as evil and chaotic as Loki here, that will only break frith anc cause problems. Let's go bother them and threaten to burn the ve down."

*groan* Don't you just love it when people allegedly wanting to defend themselves against an "undesirable" element end up acting like even bigger assholes than the people they are defending themselves against, or breaking all the same rules of hospitality and human decency that you allege they will?

I still don't get it. I see enough commonalities between the two that no way, no how would I take him lightly.

Oh, me neither. Appearing friendly and not being quite as quick to anger as the rest of your family (I suspect he has a long fuse, not invested in much to be extremely angry over it) does not equal being harmless, fuck with him at your peril. Not being combat oriented (and he isn't, direct physical confrontation is not his style) does not mean that there aren't a thousand other ways he can make you suffer (especially when tied to things like luck) and that he won't take great pleasure in doing so (he will). I've seen him rip the rug out from under people, he can shatter your life if he wants to.

As a bit of UPG that the Pixie Hermes crowd would not like, I don't see him as a god that coddles people; he was never depicted as swimming in wealth and luxuery whatever some people want to believe, but was seen as a traveler, a trickster, a messenger, etc. roles that require you to survive by your wits, and as such he doesn't seem to suffer fools lightly or have much sympathy for you if you trip and fall on your own sword. If you were to, for example, write your savings away to that email Nigerian prince with the banking problems I don't think his reaction would be to give you a big hug and there there you; he'd be more likely to ask what you were thinking, why did you let yourself get taken in by that, why didn't you look into this before you wrote a check, maybe next time you'll make better decisions. He's not going to hold your hand and pet you on the head whatever you do.

Apollo gets the same treatment, and as I've been threatened by him (it was a bad couple of years, I was horrible to Poseidon, I totally deserved it and needed it even) I know better than to see him as all happy and light and sun and yay!

Apollo was hostile to me for a number of years, though now that I understand the reason for it and things have mellowed out, he is still someone I am Not Allowed to have a relationship with beyond a very casual just because you have a shrine in my house and own my girlfriend sort of thing. And well, you know what her relationship with him is, so yeah I don't see the happy light sunshine yay there either. :-)