I like omni, myself, but only the particular kind of omni that has an explicit narrator telling you a story - as for example in Alexandre Dumas (and beautifully pastiched in Steven Brust's Khaavren books starting with The Phoenix Guards) - who is a character in their own right. IMO that's pretty solidly there in English literature until Dickens breaks it and it then degenerates into headhopping bestseller-omni that we have now, which is undisciplined and yucky
( ... )
where part of the point is that there is no Big Bad, that more than one side of a struggle is sympathetic, which I find more interesting than an Evil Which Is To Be Defeated.
by occurring in realistically large and complicated worlds where plans crash into each other, hit unexpected obstacles and generate consequences that nobody had realised
These are things I love and aspire to as well. However, as my wrangling with the project in question (check the tags, I call it That Thing That Will Not Stay Written) has proven, I'm not yet at a point where I can handle something that huge and complicated. I would love to; most of my ideas emerge that way in my head. I just don't yet have the skill to achieve something like that, and I know that. I have yet to finish a full novel, as in write a first draft, and edit edit edit until it's a passable manuscript, then edit again until I have something worthy of even thinking about submitting anywhere. For me, I think I need to start small, start simple, and work my way up to epic novels of
( ... )
These are things I love and aspire to as well. However, as my wrangling with the project in question (check the tags, I call it That Thing That Will Not Stay Written) has proven, I'm not yet at a point where I can handle something that huge and complicated.
Fair enough; I didn't mean to come across as pushy, and I certainly sympathise with not trying to do things you're not yet ready for.
(Most of my villains, btw, are not evil in the way of "good vs. evil" black-and-white. They're usually sympathetic in some way. I hope the reader can understand why they do what they do, even if the reader wouldn't choose that path.)
It seems to me that very few people, however villainous, are Evil from their own POV. I try to make my antagonists understandable, at least; wouldn't say I need them to be sympathetic.
I find it very difficult to stay in one PoV for very long, because there's usually a great deal going on, and usually in more than one place. So the PoV switching allows me to show what's going on in all those places leading up to the
( ... )
Fair enough; I didn't mean to come across as pushy,
Not pushy so much as you definitely have an idea of what you like and don't like. :) And I'm a person who likes what I like even if other people don't, and for most things (except Twilight, grr), I can honestly say I don't see a problem with liking to write or read them. What I mean is, I'm seeing a trend in people coming down hard on certain types of writing in the fantasy genre ("Eurofantasy" and the like), pushing for a break from these types of plots, stories, settings, and characters. Which is fine, I think it's a great thing to introduce more influences from other cultures. But I also happen to like some of the things people are trashing now, and don't see why there can't be both for the people who enjoy them.
It seems to me that very few people, however villainous, are Evil from their own POV.
Very true.
I am, I think, just tired of books that do that with no discipline at all, when having that information come through fewer POVs makes for tighter and more controlled
( ... )
Not pushy so much as you definitely have an idea of what you like and don't like. :)
I like most things if they are done well enough, fwiw.
What I mean is, I'm seeing a trend in people coming down hard on certain types of writing in the fantasy genre ("Eurofantasy" and the like), pushing for a break from these types of plots, stories, settings, and characters.
Can't say as I've been inordinately aware of that myself.
I understand. The new plot for TTTWNSW definitely will pare down the number of PoV characters. I always try to think very carefully about why I write a certain scene from a certain PoV, and where in the narrative that scene should fit.
*nod* and how much and what each scene is doing ? (Thinking of C.J. Cherryh's comment to the effect that a scene doing fewer than three things should not be in a book.)
(hence my dislike of omnicient, which to me just seems like really sloppy PoV switching, and not a PoV in its own right).
Depends how it's done.
Of caring about one set of characters more than another, or skipping
( ... )
*set pontificate-mode=ON*
I like omni, myself, but only the particular kind of omni that has an explicit narrator telling you a story - as for example in Alexandre Dumas (and beautifully pastiched in Steven Brust's Khaavren books starting with The Phoenix Guards) - who is a character in their own right. IMO that's pretty solidly there in English literature until Dickens breaks it and it then degenerates into headhopping bestseller-omni that we have now, which is undisciplined and yucky ( ... )
Reply
by occurring in realistically large and complicated worlds where plans crash into each other, hit unexpected obstacles and generate consequences that nobody had realised
These are things I love and aspire to as well. However, as my wrangling with the project in question (check the tags, I call it That Thing That Will Not Stay Written) has proven, I'm not yet at a point where I can handle something that huge and complicated. I would love to; most of my ideas emerge that way in my head. I just don't yet have the skill to achieve something like that, and I know that. I have yet to finish a full novel, as in write a first draft, and edit edit edit until it's a passable manuscript, then edit again until I have something worthy of even thinking about submitting anywhere. For me, I think I need to start small, start simple, and work my way up to epic novels of ( ... )
Reply
Fair enough; I didn't mean to come across as pushy, and I certainly sympathise with not trying to do things you're not yet ready for.
(Most of my villains, btw, are not evil in the way of "good vs. evil" black-and-white. They're usually sympathetic in some way. I hope the reader can understand why they do what they do, even if the reader wouldn't choose that path.)
It seems to me that very few people, however villainous, are Evil from their own POV. I try to make my antagonists understandable, at least; wouldn't say I need them to be sympathetic.
I find it very difficult to stay in one PoV for very long, because there's usually a great deal going on, and usually in more than one place. So the PoV switching allows me to show what's going on in all those places leading up to the ( ... )
Reply
Not pushy so much as you definitely have an idea of what you like and don't like. :) And I'm a person who likes what I like even if other people don't, and for most things (except Twilight, grr), I can honestly say I don't see a problem with liking to write or read them. What I mean is, I'm seeing a trend in people coming down hard on certain types of writing in the fantasy genre ("Eurofantasy" and the like), pushing for a break from these types of plots, stories, settings, and characters. Which is fine, I think it's a great thing to introduce more influences from other cultures. But I also happen to like some of the things people are trashing now, and don't see why there can't be both for the people who enjoy them.
It seems to me that very few people, however villainous, are Evil from their own POV.
Very true.
I am, I think, just tired of books that do that with no discipline at all, when having that information come through fewer POVs makes for tighter and more controlled ( ... )
Reply
I like most things if they are done well enough, fwiw.
What I mean is, I'm seeing a trend in people coming down hard on certain types of writing in the fantasy genre ("Eurofantasy" and the like), pushing for a break from these types of plots, stories, settings, and characters.
Can't say as I've been inordinately aware of that myself.
I understand. The new plot for TTTWNSW definitely will pare down the number of PoV characters. I always try to think very carefully about why I write a certain scene from a certain PoV, and where in the narrative that scene should fit.
*nod* and how much and what each scene is doing ? (Thinking of C.J. Cherryh's comment to the effect that a scene doing fewer than three things should not be in a book.)
(hence my dislike of omnicient, which to me just seems like really sloppy PoV switching, and not a PoV in its own right).
Depends how it's done.
Of caring about one set of characters more than another, or skipping ( ... )
Reply
Leave a comment