Feedback please

[bridgemus]

Scenario:

A guy really likes a girl. The girl does not like the guy at all. The girl tells the boy that she just wants to be friends. The boy asks the girl if she wants to go to dinner, and then when they are out to dinner, he buys for her.

Is this a date? Answer from the guy's or girl's or an outsider's position

Comments

Answer: yes. Reason: 99.9% of guys are fucking scum-bags.

[thatboomerkid_1]

Okay, it's like this, kid: imagine a monkey.
Like, a really cute little funny monkey wid big ears and a stoopid grin.
Now imagine that this monkey is higher than a fucking kite on god-only-knows-what assortment of high-powered mood-&-perception-altering drugs.
Now imagine that this monkey slips & falls out of a REALLY tall tree and cracks his big-'ol monkey-noggin on solid, unforgiving Terra Firma.
Now, he opens his eyes, our little monkey friend, and he is confused - he knows nothing, comprehends nothing, understands only partially only what he directly percieves directly before him, through a haze of powerful chemicals and back-logged instinct and fleeting memories of some basic level of socialization and his own (admittedly intense) intellectual limitations.
Now, the first thing that this monkey's eyes fall upon, he will desire with all his might - this, he thinks, will cure the pain in my head and clear my vision & finally give clarity to the world, be it a banana or a girl-monkey or a beer or sports or violence or rampant nationalism or an SUV or The Church.
You see where I'm headed with this, chicita-banana?
I, like all males, live with the Grand & Damaged Monkey-Spirit in the back of my head, hollering out for attention & blood-shed, every single moment of every single day.
I am a GOD of pure, piercing intellect, clear as a silver fish in a river of lightening, enslaved for eternity to the will & whimsy of a thrashing earthworm.
And 99.9% of men do not even bother to fight back the will of the Mad Rapist Ape, instead giving him a comfy seat behind the wheel and occasionally throwing out helpful directions towarsthe nearest beer-store.
And yes, this guy OBVIOUSLY wants a little bit of Bridget - and I do not blame him, for the record. Not gonna lie: to the right eyes, you light up a room like fucking Chinese New-Year; and let's not forget that boys are notorious for always wanting precisely what the CANNOT HAVE.
But my beef with the dude is that he would be slimy & shit-headed enough to play the 'friends go out to dinners with their female friends & pick up the check all the time!' card - that's so low, basal and cliche that there exists no real TERM for it - and I have to wonder if he's fooling HIMSELF.
Jesus, and this is the gender that cured polio?
Shit, yeah, I've bought plenty of dinners for girls I had NO interest in - I'm a nice guy, goddamnit - but unless this girl dating one of my BEST friends or I've known her for more than a decade, bitch better pay for her own meal, because at the end of the day, Money = Power, and power-plays are BULLSHIT among friends.
This guy is squeezing you for whatever vulnerablity he can get out of you, notamoment of doubt in my head.
But you know? That's just me. I could be wrong. Whatever.
Still: my mostly-unsolicited advice is thus: if you wanna be pals (and never forget that he can NEVER just be your pal, at this point), do so with open eyes and prepped for betrayal, my gender's speciality - because for every Jesus, there's a Judas. Or two. Or three.

Re: Answer: yes. Reason: 99.9% of guys are fucking scum-bags.

[bridgemus]

Finally the answer I was looking for... you rock my fucking world, Boomer. Now my problem is getting it to fall before the right eyes, but I'm sure that will happen soon enough. ::muah:: Thank you

Re: Answer: yes. Reason: 99.9% of guys are fucking scum-bags.

[cerulean_dreams]

Gee, thanks a lot! She won't listen to my two friends because they don't give her the answer she is looking for. The girl in this situation is me. And Greg is my friend. He knows for a fact that I do not want a relationship because I tell him EVERY time that we hang out. He never asks, I just let him know.

The only reason he pays for me EVERY NOW AND THEN (not always) is because I am constantly broke and do not want to spend my hard earned cash on anything but gas money to get me down to WIU. He knows this. So, whenever he is truly bored, he calls me and we hang out. He pays if we go anywhere because it was his decision to go out in the first place. Get it? Still think this is the same problem? Or does Bridget have another monkey on her back?

Who knows, but I love her anyway.

Woah, didn't mean to step on any toes.

[thatboomerkid_1]

My retraction & self-debasement follows: as the information was presented at the time, and in an angry state of mind, I gave some questionable-quality introspection and advice.
Upon further consideration, I have come to the realization that I have no idea what in the hell I'm talking about, and will promptly shut the fuck up.
Especialy considering that I, to be perfectly honest, don't know you, don't know your guy-friend, and barely even know Bridget.
Also: no, Brigdet has no back-moneky . . . that I KNOW ABOUT. My investigation begins . . .
Anyhoo: In my defense: I think that I perhaps DID conclusively prove that guys, even when well-intentioned & articulate, are simple-minded, rage-ful, petty and self-obsessed.
So there you have it.
So on the off chance that I was completely wrong AND that this guy is a much better dude than 99.9% of us, I say that you can accept an occasional meal from a guy and assume that he's not secretly pining over you.
But, and I'll re-iterate, I might be wrong.

Re: Woah, didn't mean to step on any toes.

[cerulean_dreams]

I'm sorry Boomer! I wasn't trying really disagreeing with you about guys being like they tend to be... I agree completely. And maybe I was just being stubborn (as I tend to be)

I guess it can be considered a date, for Greg is not gay and he does like me. Perhaps I am leading him on... but, I tell him every time we hang out that nothing will become of us.

But still, I suppose I am giving him false hope. The thing is, he is a great guy and I would hate to lose our friendship simply because he's developed a thing for me... it's not fair.

But, once again, I'm sorry if it seemed like I was yelling or judging you, I swear that I wasn't! And you DO know what you are talking about, for you are a guy and most straight guys think the same (as far as I can tell at least)

So just to close this on a good note, I really cannot wait to meet you for you seem like a fascinating and fabulous individual! See you next thursday!

Let me put it this way:

[thatboomerkid_1]

Point #1: I never thought that you were yelling at me or nothing - although I wouldn't have been real offended if you had. I was a dorkus-malorkus (as my lil' sis would say), and you were real nice about it, much to your credit.
Point #2: I would like to think that this guy could be responsible/sentient enough not to go all crushing on you & destroying your friendship with him for no good reason, and the Transhumanist in me says that it's SO possible for that to happen, but the Mechanical-Materialist in me says 'not going happing, brotha-man', so I'm nervous just by nature. Idealism in this regard is not, in my opinion, wrong - and until this duder gives you a reason not to trust him, I say: go for that brass-ring of faith in basic human decency.
As for all of us mildly-evolved, smart-girl-loving straight-boys, we ARE trying to make a better name for ourselves. Like, for seriously. In penanace, I'll be wearing a skirt next week.
Point #3: I am excited about this up-and-coming next Thursday as well. We'll get 'faced, talk Buffy, fight The Man with cricket-bats and check out hotties together, like mother-fucking Christ intended.
It'll be SWEEEEEEEET.

Re: Let me put it this way:

[cerulean_dreams]

I must say that I am all for the getting 'faced and fighting The Man with cricket-bats... as for the talking Buffy, that is more Bridget's area. Now, if you want to talk X-files or Fraggle Rock then I am your girl!

Fraggle Rock fucking RULES.

[thatboomerkid_1]

I'm a giant X-Files/Millenium dork, too.
Sothat's cool. And no worries, kid - me and Bridget will have you quoting shamelessly from 'Once More With Feeling' in NO time.

Re: Answer: yes. Reason: 99.9% of guys are fucking scum-bags.

[lenatheraven]

Please don't think I am taking sides, but this is ridiculous. Eli takes me out all the time, Travis pays for my meals, Tiff has taken me out, Allison has taken me out, James has taken me out, Lauren has taken me out, Jessi has taken me out, and none of which have I EVER dated.

I am not trying to look like I am on Beth's side, but there is more to a date than who pays for a meal. People like me stay broke and still have bored, hungry friends.

My advice to both Bri and Beth...AVOID FIGHTS WHEN POSSIBLE. I have learned the hard way that it is so much easier to let a dead dog lay (or lie, not sure). Don't pull things looking to "win" an argument and don't help an argument arise. It isn't worth it. I love you two too much to sit here in Kentucky all by my lonesome thinking that you both are always upset over something so little. Trust me. I would kill if my recently proclaimed ex would chat with me, or come see me, but things aren't that easy. Be happy you aren't completely apart. I am and I know it hurts. You two don't deserve what I am going through. No one does. When possible, let the little things go.

Re: Answer: yes. Reason: 99.9% of guys are fucking scum-bags.

[lenatheraven]

not every man is like that...there are some that can still breathe with their legs together. You sound so stereotypical. You honestly make me sick to think that you would want to be a part of some group only to make them sound like sex driven alcoholics that would do anything to see some one bleed or see some one naked. Honestly, you sound as if you must be thinking you just should tell Bri what she seems to want to hear.

Re: Answer: yes. Reason: 99.9% of guys are fucking scum-bags.

[bridgemus]

First of all, I love you dearly, but I'd prefer you not attack my friends... if you'd like to do so, I don't want to know about it... it's just that I think he assessed the situation very differently from the way that you & Beth did because you've been in similar situations and see them from your own perspective... I was asking for more of a general, outsiders perspective, and while that's not exactly what he gave me, I don't believe by any means that he was just telling me what I wanted to hear... I have only ever even met him once, and this is the first time he's ever read my journal. I don't believe he even knows what I want to hear... I think it's clear that he thought that it was me going out with a guy who liked me, which is an entirely different situation from the one that you and Beth addressed... anyway, the point of this is just... I don't know what the point is... I guess just know that your opinion isn't the only opinion... the whole goal of this entry was to get a variety of perspectives and explanations behind them. Alright, I'm done ranting. Still love ya, but I had to say that.

See, this is why I shouldn't be allowed to play on the computer after I've been drinking.

[thatboomerkid_1]

First and foremost, I'm just glad to know that my gender still has some defenders out there, even if they HAPPEN to think that I'm a complete asshole (and who are probably right on both counts).
Jeni, you're damn cool in my book, and I'm quite, quite glad that you haven't had the same shit thrown at you that I have by dudes-in-general & can keep the faith.
No blood,nofoul.
Secondly, I'd like to specifically appologize if any of my wild tirades against all that is patriarchal were inapproprite or offensive - I tend to get a-might-bit rowdy when I'm saucy, and since I can't throw a punch, occasionally I lash out with my tongue, or my pen, or my . . . mouse-button, I guess. The computer, I mean.
Thirdly (and most importantly), I hope that no one here thought that I was attempting to (a) tell Bridget what she wanted to hear, considering that I was in all actuality going for the antithesis of slimy charm, the brutal & shocking revelation of the most horrible & uncomfortable of all possible truths in order to snap her out of a 'but this guy is my buddy!' mindframe, a tactic completely inapproppriate (I later discovered) to the actual situation at hand, or to (b) take any type of side in a relationship-based arguement, considering again that I was COMPLETELY unaware of multiple pre-existing conditions that made my 'insights' more-or-less into washed-up anti-propaganda.
Fourthly, I just wanna throw out this old chesnut: I'm a white-boy fucking 24-year old English Major currently barely scaping by at a State University Undergraduate level who's spent most of the last half-decade in a drug & nihlism-fuled rage against all forms of social control and who hasn't been in a REAL relationship in four years - what I know about the intricacies of human spiritual & emotional interation I could write on the back of a goddamn knitting needle with a big ol' fat black Magic Marker and have room left over for the Lord's Prayer eight or nine times.
Point being: I don't know shit about shit - a lot like Plato when he was REALLY young, I occasionally like to fantasize.
Anyway, my wrathful condemnation of the Male Species stands for the moment, as does Jeni's righteous disgust at my opinion.
Also: Bridget, thank you for giving me a place to vent my spleen, even if I did temporarily transform your LJ into a fucking warzone and no-doubt angered 99% of your friends and possibly damaged your relationship with a very, very sweet girl for all time - and thanks for sticking up for stupid ol' Boomer even when his 'Make Angry Sounds' button seems to be stuck & pointing in the wrong direction.

Re: See, this is why I shouldn't be allowed to play on the computer after I've been drinking.

[lenatheraven]

I've had dude-in-general shit thrown at me. I've been molested and damn near raped. And through therapy behind my parents' backs I have learned that not every one in ANY group is the same. Except to say that all real lesbians like girls. That's the same (insert chuckle at my attempt at humor here). I am just saying that no one can generalize a group and think that all of their bad traits are standard in each.

I have my own chestnut to throw: I am a 17-year-old, schizophrenic, Native American, lesbian in my senior year of high school living in the white supremacits bible belt. I know that there is no such thing as an accurate stereotype. I am a minority in all counts. Yet there is no way to tell what all others in those groups are like simply by my actions.

And if you can look past my rampage to say I am damn cool. I am sorry for seeming to think you were just a male asshole. My bad for being prejudice based on your comment. Loves to you and sorry for my oh-so-overly rash behavior.

Your faith in basic human decency brightens my day as well asmy soul.

[thatboomerkid_1]

Well, it looks like you've been through a hell that I can't even concieve of and have yet come out whole, non-cynical & on occasion, smiling.
I quite plainly have a thing or two that I could learn about life from you.
*sigh*
Okay, you win the flamewar.
*grin*

Re: Answer: yes. Reason: 99.9% of guys are fucking scum-bags.

[lenatheraven]

sorry Bri, read what I wrote to him. I didn't mean for my first reply to seem so harsh.