Why SPN Needs To Catch A Case of “Glee” (spoilers for SPN 6x08 and Glee 2x06)

[bowtrunckle]

Bargggh!  Hello, flist!  Breaking radio silence!  :D  I feel like I've been stuck in a well for the last month or two or five, but (I think?) I've escaped for now.  *looks around*  Freedom means fandom dorkery, which means Show, which means mindless nattering, which sometimes means meta.  \o/  So ... after watching this past week’s episode of "Glee

Comments

[galathea_snb]

Hm, interesting. :) I think I feel differently about it all exactly because I feel that Dean shows that all he wants is his real brother back. Yes, he is angry and violent and resentful, but all these emotions are directed towards this not!version of his brother. To me it comes off as Dean hating robo!Sam so much exactly because he is not his Sammy, but a travesty of the real thing. And the reason he stays with this Sam is because he is the only tangible link to his real brother.

I actually do sympathise with this Sam. Especially in 4x08 where he says that he remembers how much he suffered when he had a soul and that it has been easier, less hurtful, without his soul. So for a long time he really didn't want his soul back and I sympathise with that. But then he spends a couple of weeks with his brother and is reminded of the good things in his past self. I don't think that's a coincidence. And yes, I would have liked for Sam to finish that sentence but to me it was clear that he was talking about Dean, when he mentions the good things in his past life.

So, yeah, I want them to return Sam's soul sooner rather than later, so we can move on to the aftermath of it all, but so far I actually find the set-up for the characters intriguing. :)

Edit: And you know, I actually dropped Glee this season because I think it became unbearingly pointless. The characterisations stopped making sense to me ever since the show came back after the first half of S1. I feel the songs became random and the layers in the narrative and especially the clear direction were gone. I was pretty disappointed with the show.

[bowtrunckle]

but all these emotions are directed towards this not!version of his brother

I need to separate S6Sam from S1-S5Sam because, to me, even though what we're seeing isn't the same Sam as before, to me, this is still Sam ... just Sam stripped down, Sam without part of himself, a more feral Sam without his empathetic soul to buffer his thoughts/instincts/urges from the rest of the world. So when I see Dean taking his frustrations out on Sam and being disdainful and angry, I see Dean doing that to Sammy, his little brother. This isn't to say Dean isn't entitled to his feelings or that Sam doesn't deserve it. But my knee jerk reaction (no matter how much I try to rationalize it, no matter what my head thinks) is just "Oh, noooo, boys." :(

But then he spends a couple of weeks with his brother and is reminded of the good things in his past self. I don't think that's a coincidence.

I'm not disagreeing with you. It's just that I'm having a hard time seeing why Sam would think that anything in the last couple of weeks could be remotely good. I'm not seeing/feeling any sort of warmth or connection between Sam and Dean (and that's probably the way it should be to heighten the Sam and Dean's soul reunion later on this season), and, to me, it seems like S6Sam probably wouldn't/couldn't care about an emotional connection. Instead, it would make sense that he's staying with Dean or wanting to keep Dean with him for some strategic purpose. However, I don't understand logically what that could be. Is Sam just hanging in there because he thinks it's a good idea to have Dean around? That's a bit tenuous for me. A character without emotion must be motivated by something external, which I'm not sure what it could be for Sam (it seems like he's not understanding why a soul would be a good thing). And that's why I have a hard time understanding/sympathizing with S6 Sam.

it was clear that he was talking about Dean, when he mentions the good things in his past life.

I hope that's what he was thinking about. For me, it wasn't so clear cut. But that's probably because the state of Sam and Dean's current relationship makes me wonder why Sam would want to hang around...

I actually find the set-up for the characters intriguing. :)

Yes, I agree. It is interesting! I find the execution a little unsatisfying, though. *sad face*

I'm glad you keep chiming in with your thoughts about this season. I need other people on my flist to help remind me there are other interpretations of what we're seeing on screen, ones that are much more hopeful and happy. :)

The characterisations stopped making sense to me ever since the show came back after the first half of S1. I feel the songs became random and the layers in the narrative and especially the clear direction were gone.

Both points are spot on. There were a couple of early S1 episodes that were good with clever song integration that service the story and some interesting relationships were being seeded (I liked the episode "Wheels" and the pilot episode was well done and hilarious). Then I don't know what happened. I thought last season's finale was terribly boring and predictable. And I actually feel that S2 has been pretty clunky, with the characters and dialogue contrived to service the songs of the episode. But I've decided that Glee isn't a show that will have consistent characterizations or a riveting narrative. The characters won't make sense because they're mainly a vehicle for stitching together songs and dance numbers and there are simply too many characters and underdeveloped sub-plots such that the narrative won't be anything other than superficial. Glee the kind of brainless TV that just makes me happy because Sue Sylvester runs around and flaps her gums and there is dancing and gay boys named Kurt (the one character who had a through-going story that resonates). For me, Glee is like cotton candy: fluffy and sweet and full of empty calories, but you can't help but be a bit manic about because it gives you a sugar rush. Yay, sugar rush! *manic, brainless smile*

[galathea_snb]

to me, this is still Sam
Oh, I agree, this is definitely still Sam. It's his body and his memories, all his intellectual knowledge and his character traits, but the inherent 'Sam-ness' is gone. Dean's frustration is all about the fact that the brother he knows and loves is still as unreachable as he was when Sam was in Lucifer's cage. I understand Dean's frustration, but unless Sam gave aways his soul willingly - and even then I need to know the exact circumstances - I don't think Sam deserves any of Dean's violence. It's not as if Sam could help it or hurts Dean deliberately.

And for the record: My knee-jerk reaction is also 'Oh, no, boys!' - but then I try to get past that and think about it. That helps. :)

It's just that I'm having a hard time seeing why Sam would think that anything in the last couple of weeks could be remotely good.
Oh, but Sam's statment wasn't about the last couple of weeks. It was about memories he has from his souled self. There are all these memories involving Dean and rationally Sam knows that those are happy memories. He knows that he loved his brother, that Dean was his partner, best friend, soulmate, even though he can't feel that anymore. I think for an analytical person like Sam it has to be maddening to have all these memories and being unable to understand them. It's like an itch he cannot scratch and I think he needs some sort of resolution to that problem, on a purely intellectual level.

I'm not seeing/feeling any sort of warmth or connection between Sam and Dean , and, to me, it seems like S6Sam probably wouldn't/couldn't care about an emotional connection.
No, Sam doesn't care at all about an emotional connection with Dean. As he says in 6.09 'I can't care about what I can't care about'. Sam can't care about Dean and Dean only cares about the real Sam, so there can be no connection between robo!Sam and souled!Dean. Dean sticks with robo!Sam because he needs him to restore his brother. And as for Sam: I agree that it is difficult to see why Sam would stick with Dean at all. It's possible that he has an external agenda we simply don't know about yet, but personally, I think it's because of what I said above about Sam's memories of Dean. Plus, given Sam's current inability to sympathise with civilians, I can only imagine that it is easier for him to hunt with Dean at his side. :)

But I've decided that Glee isn't a show that will have consistent characterizations or a riveting narrative.
Hm, maybe. Maybe my expectations were too high. I absolutely adored the first half of S1 and I have no idea what happened after. I tend to think that the producers thought that they will not be picked up for a full season, let alone 3(!), and hence gave it all in those first episodes, planned it out in one satisfying arc and then didn't know what to do when they got picked up. I watch my fair share of fluffy, happy, sweet shows, but I couldn't get past my disappointment with Glee. *shrugs*