My stance on the developments in the Buffy comics
It seems that everyone is posting their views on the latest development in Buffy season 9 - it''s mostly lot of anger and outrage at Buffy being put in that kind of situation by the writers, or, from the other side that it OK with the storyline, vehement denial of the disturbing consent issues. My view seems to be unusual. I've been ambivalent about this from the start, but I haven't been for or against the storyline - I am withholding my judgment until I see how they deal with it. It may be awful or great. But I am willing to give more credit to Whedon and Dark Horse than most people are doing.
There's one thing that is certain: it's a horrific, traumatizing scenario -waking up and thinking you might have had sex while so drunk you don't remember, and then learning you're pregnant from that, and not knowing how and with whom and if it was consensual or if you were raped? A lot of us feel the dread and trauma that this would cause. The idea of being so incapacitated you might not have had the control over your own body anymore, and even worse, the not knowing, not remembering what even happened to you? It's terrifying.
But awful, traumatizing things have happened in BtVS before, since season 1. Which is why I'm not on principle against the storyline. But it's the attitude in some corners of the fandom that has been making me furious. It hurts when some people are completely, aggressively dismissive and keep insisting that it's really not that bad at all, don't make a big deal out of it.It's even worse when they make arguments such as that it must have been consensual because she obviously wanted sex with anyone handy, since she flirted with her exes, touched her male best friend's hand, and danced a lot. And wore a short skirt, as Georges Jeanty said in his terrible, thoughtless remark. I just...have no words. It's that kind of crap that's been driving me bad and souring all this, even if the actual story turns out to be good.
Where I differ from most people on both sides on the fence is that I don't think that Whedon and Dark Horse are necessarily unaware of the consent issues.(Well, apart from Jeanty who I'm sure is not.) The popular views seem to be that they either went with the storyline because they didn't realize it, and that makes them really gross (yes, I agree it does if that's the case) or that they are no consent issues since they haven't been explicitly raised in #1. I don't think that if there is no "Was I raped?" "Maybe you were raped!" moment in the next issue, that it would mean the consent issues are non-existent. It doesn't work like that, which some people don't seem to understand even after repeated explanations. The consent issues are already there in the story, by virtue of a heroine not having any idea what happened the night she got pregnant. I don't expect anyone to even mention that dreadful possibilities explicitly, but it's what makes the situation all the more painful. I can see Buffy not even wanting to remember what happened and her friends being understanding and not saying the obvious things that would just be hurtful.
Like many other people, I feel that it's a disturbing storyline, but I don't agree with the assumption that if Whedon and Dark Horse realized how disturbing it was, they certainly wouldn't be doing it. They may be fully aware of what they're doing. I don't think the story we're getting will be treated as funny and cute - and I don't think it was in #1 either, which was full of underlying despair and showed Buffy feel shame but also dread at what might have happened.
I have had a far more charitable reading of Scott Allie's latest interview than most people have. This statement:
"Spoiler alert -- this will be one of the most upsetting aspects of the story, for some readers. Buffy doesn't know. Some readers will have a hard time with the idea that their hero could have gotten into this situation without knowing who the father is. She got black-out drunk in #1, and it turns out there are significant consequences. If the objection is that this couldn't or shouldn't happen to Buffy, it seems to me that that objection comes from the idea that there's something wrong with women to whom this does happen, that it is something beneath Buffy herself, and the fact that Joss and Sierra [Hahn, editor] and Andrew and I disagree with that is the reason why we think this is a viable storyline for Buffy.
was taken by many to mean that he's implying that anyone who has a problem with the storyline is slut-shaming, even though most people are concerned because of the consent issues. I took it to mean that these horrific scenarios happen to women in real life, and there is nothing wrong with these women; and therefore it can also happen to Buffy, the established feminist icon. It doesn't mean that she can't be a hero anymore. It is problematic that she gets her agency compromised or taken away, again - but if someone really did take advantage of her, if she was date raped, it's not her fault, it's not something that's beneath her.
I will think so much more highly of Joss and DH if they aren't just looking for a plot device to get Buffy baby!fic, but if they're approaching the situation pf how she got pregnant with all the seriousness. I took this as a good sign, and I was also relieved that they decided to say it as it is immediately rather than fuel the annoying "who's the daddy" debates by not saying anything and letting people wonder if Buffy will reveal the identity of the father in #6. I'd like to believe that this is what they're trying to say: those awful things sometimes happen to women, including the strong, smart women, and it doesn't have to mean that their lives are ruined if they've been victimized, or that they have been permanently degraded and weakened. It can be a great story if they recognize all the upsetting aspects and then show Buffy finding strength to go on despite the traumas and hardships and adversity. In that way, it can be inspiring.
I'm hopeful. Season 8 started off with Buffy in an apparently most powerful position ever, as a leader of a Slayer army, but the season was all about progressively tearing her down, with the culmination in the Twilight/Last Gleaming arc. The exception was #40 which showed her back to being the 'underdog' and trying to deal with her situation the best she could. This season has started with Buffy in a bad emotional, social and financial situation and feeling lost, and the first arc has heaped a lot of problems on her - and it seems like there will soon be more... I'm holding out hope that it is structured the opposite way to season 8, and that the season will slowly build Buffy back up, show her strength and allow her to sort out her life and find herself. Maybe she'll even be allowed some happiness after all the torment heaped on her.
This entry was originally posted at http://timetravellingbunny.dreamwidth.org/. Comment here or there, as you like.
There's one thing that is certain: it's a horrific, traumatizing scenario -waking up and thinking you might have had sex while so drunk you don't remember, and then learning you're pregnant from that, and not knowing how and with whom and if it was consensual or if you were raped? A lot of us feel the dread and trauma that this would cause. The idea of being so incapacitated you might not have had the control over your own body anymore, and even worse, the not knowing, not remembering what even happened to you? It's terrifying.
But awful, traumatizing things have happened in BtVS before, since season 1. Which is why I'm not on principle against the storyline. But it's the attitude in some corners of the fandom that has been making me furious. It hurts when some people are completely, aggressively dismissive and keep insisting that it's really not that bad at all, don't make a big deal out of it.It's even worse when they make arguments such as that it must have been consensual because she obviously wanted sex with anyone handy, since she flirted with her exes, touched her male best friend's hand, and danced a lot. And wore a short skirt, as Georges Jeanty said in his terrible, thoughtless remark. I just...have no words. It's that kind of crap that's been driving me bad and souring all this, even if the actual story turns out to be good.
Where I differ from most people on both sides on the fence is that I don't think that Whedon and Dark Horse are necessarily unaware of the consent issues.(Well, apart from Jeanty who I'm sure is not.) The popular views seem to be that they either went with the storyline because they didn't realize it, and that makes them really gross (yes, I agree it does if that's the case) or that they are no consent issues since they haven't been explicitly raised in #1. I don't think that if there is no "Was I raped?" "Maybe you were raped!" moment in the next issue, that it would mean the consent issues are non-existent. It doesn't work like that, which some people don't seem to understand even after repeated explanations. The consent issues are already there in the story, by virtue of a heroine not having any idea what happened the night she got pregnant. I don't expect anyone to even mention that dreadful possibilities explicitly, but it's what makes the situation all the more painful. I can see Buffy not even wanting to remember what happened and her friends being understanding and not saying the obvious things that would just be hurtful.
Like many other people, I feel that it's a disturbing storyline, but I don't agree with the assumption that if Whedon and Dark Horse realized how disturbing it was, they certainly wouldn't be doing it. They may be fully aware of what they're doing. I don't think the story we're getting will be treated as funny and cute - and I don't think it was in #1 either, which was full of underlying despair and showed Buffy feel shame but also dread at what might have happened.
I have had a far more charitable reading of Scott Allie's latest interview than most people have. This statement:
"Spoiler alert -- this will be one of the most upsetting aspects of the story, for some readers. Buffy doesn't know. Some readers will have a hard time with the idea that their hero could have gotten into this situation without knowing who the father is. She got black-out drunk in #1, and it turns out there are significant consequences. If the objection is that this couldn't or shouldn't happen to Buffy, it seems to me that that objection comes from the idea that there's something wrong with women to whom this does happen, that it is something beneath Buffy herself, and the fact that Joss and Sierra [Hahn, editor] and Andrew and I disagree with that is the reason why we think this is a viable storyline for Buffy.
was taken by many to mean that he's implying that anyone who has a problem with the storyline is slut-shaming, even though most people are concerned because of the consent issues. I took it to mean that these horrific scenarios happen to women in real life, and there is nothing wrong with these women; and therefore it can also happen to Buffy, the established feminist icon. It doesn't mean that she can't be a hero anymore. It is problematic that she gets her agency compromised or taken away, again - but if someone really did take advantage of her, if she was date raped, it's not her fault, it's not something that's beneath her.
I will think so much more highly of Joss and DH if they aren't just looking for a plot device to get Buffy baby!fic, but if they're approaching the situation pf how she got pregnant with all the seriousness. I took this as a good sign, and I was also relieved that they decided to say it as it is immediately rather than fuel the annoying "who's the daddy" debates by not saying anything and letting people wonder if Buffy will reveal the identity of the father in #6. I'd like to believe that this is what they're trying to say: those awful things sometimes happen to women, including the strong, smart women, and it doesn't have to mean that their lives are ruined if they've been victimized, or that they have been permanently degraded and weakened. It can be a great story if they recognize all the upsetting aspects and then show Buffy finding strength to go on despite the traumas and hardships and adversity. In that way, it can be inspiring.
I'm hopeful. Season 8 started off with Buffy in an apparently most powerful position ever, as a leader of a Slayer army, but the season was all about progressively tearing her down, with the culmination in the Twilight/Last Gleaming arc. The exception was #40 which showed her back to being the 'underdog' and trying to deal with her situation the best she could. This season has started with Buffy in a bad emotional, social and financial situation and feeling lost, and the first arc has heaped a lot of problems on her - and it seems like there will soon be more... I'm holding out hope that it is structured the opposite way to season 8, and that the season will slowly build Buffy back up, show her strength and allow her to sort out her life and find herself. Maybe she'll even be allowed some happiness after all the torment heaped on her.
This entry was originally posted at http://timetravellingbunny.dreamwidth.org/. Comment here or there, as you like.