and I certainly don't buy into any type of "one true love" nonsense when it comes to him. No, I don't either - plus it'd be totally impractical, cos as you say, he's effectively immortal. But I can go with Ianto being the guy that he loves right now - in the same way that he loved Estelle in that "right now". Maybe that's why I'm less shattered by Ianto's death in the overall storyline than the shippers - I'm happy enough to see the overall thousands of thousands of years of life of The Face of Boe, and to know that Ianto can't possibly be with him all that time. To me that's all part of the story. And I can have fanfic to find out more about Jack/Ianto in their own "right now".
I've read some fanfic, and I've not really seen either of the scenarios that you've suggested - though maybe I've just managed to avoid it... *g* I think any fic hyping up the emotions in the way you've described is onto a loser as far as I'm concerned though, so not my kind of soppy thing. (I'd highly recommend Trying to Communicate though, if you've not read it - a brief reference to Jack/Ianto only (sorry, I can't go the way of "Janto" - one plus one does not equal one!) and one of the few fics I've actually ever laughed out loud while reading... *g*)
Out of curiousity, am I the only viewer in the entire watching world who found Ianto's clinginess and neediness in COE to be somewhat annoying and out-of-nowhere? Erm... dunno, but I didn't find it annoying or out of nowhere... *g* You mean in Ianto's death scene, where he's all insecure about Jack remembering him? And the scenes where he's trying to figure out Jack's reaction to the idea of them being "a couple"?
I didn't get that they'd been shagging since the beginning of the series, to me it was only after Cyberwoman, and possibly after Countrycide - maybe it started after They Keep Killing Suzie... I saw flirting to start with, then Jack needing to deal somehow with Ianto after Lisa's death, and that whatever happened off screen grew to be a much lighter relationship in alot of ways. I think there've always been hints that there was a bit more to their relationship than just the fun of sex though - Ianto claiming Jack to dance, at Gwen's wedding, Jack being all awkward about asking Ianto out on the date, Ianto and the coat, when Jack was gone... Not necessarily equal on both sides, not necessarily "true love", but a definite tie between them that's deeper than just physical attraction, and probably somehow from the darkness of what Ianto'd done, and how they had to deal with that.
I thought it was a fair development that Ianto was beginning to be weirded out when people saw them as a couple - because he probably knew Jack wouldn't have been, because their relationship could never be as a normal "couple", and if Ianto wasn't even out to his family then I can imagine him still sort of trying to deal with that sort of thing... And then I can see in the trauma of dying, having lost pretty much everything else, he'd perhaps be a bit clingy at the idea that his life would effectively have been meaningless if Jack forgot him - that he'd not left anything behind of import to the world, that maybe if Jack remembered him it'd mean he had been something more than a "tea boy" who shagged the boss now and then... To me, that was the bit that was sad enough... And of course, he didn't tell Ianto back that he loved him... now there's heartbreak and a huge part of the story, right there...
But then I'm not convinced that Jack's been drooling over Gwen since day one either - I think he thinks he has, perhaps, because that's what he does, and she fascinated him because she was strong enough to cope with TW, and that this sometimes confuses Gwen as well, but I think at the heart of it Gwen knows that Jack would love her in the same way that he loves Ianto, and that's not enough for her. She ultimately wants normal, a Rhys to go home to, security I think she said somewhere, and a family - and for all she wants Torchwood too, she chooses security over any feelings she might have for Jack, or thinks he might have for her. I think Jack is learning that maybe there are different kinds of love too - that he can have a non-sexually based love for Gwen, and that's a good kind of love for them...
Okay, I'm just rambling again now, and this was 300 characters too long for a single comment, so I shall go to bed and leave you in peace for now!
and I certainly don't buy into any type of "one true love" nonsense when it comes to him.
No, I don't either - plus it'd be totally impractical, cos as you say, he's effectively immortal. But I can go with Ianto being the guy that he loves right now - in the same way that he loved Estelle in that "right now". Maybe that's why I'm less shattered by Ianto's death in the overall storyline than the shippers - I'm happy enough to see the overall thousands of thousands of years of life of The Face of Boe, and to know that Ianto can't possibly be with him all that time. To me that's all part of the story. And I can have fanfic to find out more about Jack/Ianto in their own "right now".
I've read some fanfic, and I've not really seen either of the scenarios that you've suggested - though maybe I've just managed to avoid it... *g* I think any fic hyping up the emotions in the way you've described is onto a loser as far as I'm concerned though, so not my kind of soppy thing. (I'd highly recommend Trying to Communicate though, if you've not read it - a brief reference to Jack/Ianto only (sorry, I can't go the way of "Janto" - one plus one does not equal one!) and one of the few fics I've actually ever laughed out loud while reading... *g*)
Out of curiousity, am I the only viewer in the entire watching world who found Ianto's clinginess and neediness in COE to be somewhat annoying and out-of-nowhere?
Erm... dunno, but I didn't find it annoying or out of nowhere... *g* You mean in Ianto's death scene, where he's all insecure about Jack remembering him? And the scenes where he's trying to figure out Jack's reaction to the idea of them being "a couple"?
I didn't get that they'd been shagging since the beginning of the series, to me it was only after Cyberwoman, and possibly after Countrycide - maybe it started after They Keep Killing Suzie... I saw flirting to start with, then Jack needing to deal somehow with Ianto after Lisa's death, and that whatever happened off screen grew to be a much lighter relationship in alot of ways. I think there've always been hints that there was a bit more to their relationship than just the fun of sex though - Ianto claiming Jack to dance, at Gwen's wedding, Jack being all awkward about asking Ianto out on the date, Ianto and the coat, when Jack was gone... Not necessarily equal on both sides, not necessarily "true love", but a definite tie between them that's deeper than just physical attraction, and probably somehow from the darkness of what Ianto'd done, and how they had to deal with that.
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But then I'm not convinced that Jack's been drooling over Gwen since day one either - I think he thinks he has, perhaps, because that's what he does, and she fascinated him because she was strong enough to cope with TW, and that this sometimes confuses Gwen as well, but I think at the heart of it Gwen knows that Jack would love her in the same way that he loves Ianto, and that's not enough for her. She ultimately wants normal, a Rhys to go home to, security I think she said somewhere, and a family - and for all she wants Torchwood too, she chooses security over any feelings she might have for Jack, or thinks he might have for her. I think Jack is learning that maybe there are different kinds of love too - that he can have a non-sexually based love for Gwen, and that's a good kind of love for them...
Okay, I'm just rambling again now, and this was 300 characters too long for a single comment, so I shall go to bed and leave you in peace for now!
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