It's hard to say for me. While the law says its so, I typically call BS that people can't give consent when intoxicated both because a) I've been good and drunk and believe that regardless of how fucked up I get, at the end of the day I'm still responsible for my actions and b) oftentimes, as in this example, people, while still sober, make the plans that their night of drinking will include sexual activity which, while hard to prove, to me is consent before the fact.
I say all that to say: In the eyes of the law, yes it is rape. In my own personal judgment of the situation, IF all intoxicating substances she consumed were of her own free will (i.e. she wasn't dosed or given one thing and told it was another or anything) and the sex was what would be considered consensual by a reasonable person save for the intoxication, then no, it is not rape.
Here's the thing about consent: it can be taked back at any time during sex. If I consent to sex with you and halfway through I tell you to stop, would you keep going and tell me I've "consented before the fact"?
As for the scenerio given, she expected sex with ONE person, not a gang bang. And was checked out during the whole thing anyway, as she only "discovers" it in the morning.
and what's to say she didn't consent to all of them and not remember? i just think the whol scenario is too incredibly vague to make a good judgment on.
I actually agree with you. It's a horribly complicated, difficult issue that we are generally tempted to take simple ideological stances on; those stances easily fail when confronted with a complex reality.
It's true that consent can be taken back, but, while the situation here is simple and we don't know all the information, there's no evidence that it was taken back. The law as I understand it would automatically revoke the consent (and I understand that the "consent before the fact" is entirely mythical anyway, which is why I'm speaking for my opinion and not for the law) anyway as she became intoxicated, but if there's no revocation, the telling someone to stop scenario doesn't apply here
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Consent before the fact and implicit consent are not reliable defenses- and they leave room for the unethical to make false claims- but they are not mythical.
I say all that to say: In the eyes of the law, yes it is rape. In my own personal judgment of the situation, IF all intoxicating substances she consumed were of her own free will (i.e. she wasn't dosed or given one thing and told it was another or anything) and the sex was what would be considered consensual by a reasonable person save for the intoxication, then no, it is not rape.
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Here's the thing about consent: it can be taked back at any time during sex. If I consent to sex with you and halfway through I tell you to stop, would you keep going and tell me I've "consented before the fact"?
As for the scenerio given, she expected sex with ONE person, not a gang bang. And was checked out during the whole thing anyway, as she only "discovers" it in the morning.
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