First off: Avon is a truly terrible actor. Which actually fits the character perfectly in my view, so... Well done, PD? Seriously though, everything about his voice and face as tries to explain away his and Dayna's presence just shouts "I'm making this up as I go along." Loudly. "Why should you doubt me", indeed...
I'm curious about whether Zen really would have given them away by answering that line though? After all, they usually (if not always) preface their initial questions to the computer with its name ("ZEN, what's our course and speed" etc.) Logically enough, as Zen does not automatically try to answer all and any questions ever spoken out loud on the flight-deck.*
*Ahaha, or maybe I just found the solution as to why everyone keeps excessively and superfluously calling each other by name in this show: they're doing it to let any voice-activated computer that might be around know they're not talking to it, so they won't accidentally give it all kinds of weird instructions. *g*Dayna is awesome! (So awesome that they
( ... )
I'm not so sure. The more I watch this show the less I think that Avon's insults are Vila's worst problem. Many of the others (Cally in particular, but in S1 and S2 also Gan, and Blake) often have a patronising tone with him that, while superficially "kinder", looks to me like it might be more damaging in the long run, both to Vila's self-esteem and other peoples appreciation of him. In some ways, the insult-game he's got going with Avon carries a greater (if covert) degree of respect, both for his intelligence and for his ability to "take it", and it looks to me as if Vila does respond to that. When the others treat him with annoyance, or tell him to "stop whining and do as he's told", or just ignore him, he usually just seems to accept it. With Avon (who, if nothing else at least rarely ignores him), he gives as good as he gets, and often gives off a lot more confident impression in the process.
Which is not to say that I don't think they all should have treated him better, particularly in front of outsiders. But I don't think Avon
( ... )
I don't think Avon's "spare part" crack hurt Vila; it would have just been another snipe in their battle of wits. However I think Tarrant and Dayna took it as face value and it coloured their perception of him.
Cally is fond of Vila--she was glad to see him on Chenga--but yes, she's often very dismissive, especially at the end of City at the Edge.
It's no wonder Vila was depressed. I'd have bolted at the first chance, and he had some. He could have teleported to any planet they were near and thrown away his bracelet, and he obviously was capable of flying Scorpio alone. Maybe his will was completely sapped by then.
Yes, perhaps. Although in that case Vila may have done himself as much of a disservice by suggesting to them that he doesn't belong (or at least no longer wants to belong) on the Liberator in the first place. But I think neither Dayna nor Tarrant are people who have much patience with what they perceive as "weakness", and whatever the truth is, Vila doesn't exactly go for a "strong" image. I suspect he'd have had a difficult time winning them over in either case
( ... )
That middle para is an excellent point. I've generally assumed from his relatively upbeat attitude in the holding cells that he managed very well on his own, but that almost-optimism may be a result of a change in situation which can shake some people out of depression: things are suddenly different and they might be better.
I doubt people would have recognised him--their images seem to have been officially suppressed (to avoid hero-worship?) but yes, he couldn't be what all his self-esteem rests on.
I'm intrigued by how strong Vila is when he thinks Avon is dead in 'Gold'. He often acts and takes charge when no one else is there to do so (Terminal) and perhaps here it's a combo of the situation changing and not having Avon to make decisions (and belittle him). I've read a few "Vila takes over" fics, but I think it would have to be in circumstances where no one else could, and I also wonder how long he'd sustain it.
I've been a fan for 12 years now (!!!) and I still love him. No apologies; I love to discuss him and B7 in general.
It seems to me that once you stop taking Vila at face value and start to think that at least some (and possibly all) of the whole "weak, stupid, unimportant, harmless" image is just that, an image and an act, and a very good one at that... Then you have to wonder why he's doing that, and doing it almost all the time and with almost everyone, including people he knows and ought to be able to trust (like Cally)... It does look very much like he's using it as a shield and form of invisibility cloak, telling everyone that he's not a threat to them, not important enough to think twice about. And for that behaviour to be so generalised and deeply ingrained in him, I can't help but think that he must have had to deal with some very nasty people indeed in his life, and probably on a regular basis at that
( ... )
Oh yes, it's definitely an image he's projecting, right from failing to steal Blake's wallet. I imagine being too intelligent was a mark against him too, but his wit and grasp of language still shines through and Avon recognises and appreciates it. If he took Vila a face value, he wouldn't take him on so many missions that don't requires opening locks.
He's also quite practised at fitting in and making connections with people like Gan (a good choice) and Doran (definitely not one) but Doran, a very dangerous and nasty type, actually liked him, so I can see Vila doing OK with fellow criminals and prisoners and forming protective alliances. His manner and sense of humour just didn't fit in with most of the Liberator crew, though I think he really enjoyed having a real sparring partner in Avon.
I would read that S5!
I often feel embarrassed that my replies are too short!
I'm somewhat charmed by the idea that Avon sees through Vila's act more easily than the others, not because he is more perceptive but because he is less sensitive to non-verbal cues. So when Vila says something it's the words (which most clearly show his wit and intelligence) that primarily get through to Avon, while all of the non-verbal "don't-mind-me-I'm-not-important" body language just doesn't register as strongly as it may do for those who have a more "intuitive" response to him.
but Doran, a very dangerous and nasty type, actually liked himHe does seem to have a talent to get the most unpleasant types to like him (Egrorian is another example) which seems very telling. After all, I think Vila's abhorrence of violence is perhaps one of his most "true" and unfaked personality traits, so it simply can't be that he somehow condones it in these people, or is so used to it that he doesn't care. But I imagine that going into “hero mode” and confronting them has never been a realistic option for him; nor avoiding them. So he does the
( ... )
I love that explanation for why Avon sees more in Vila than the others; it rings very true.
It's not the case for Egrorian, but Doran's also the sort of person who'd get Vila's humour, honed on people very like him back on Earth. What works for them just doesn't for the Liberator people who grew up in different environments. OTOH Vila learns quickly enough that Avon is appreciative of witty banter. Maybe the others just don't have as much of a sense of humour.
Deeta, I think? :-) I keep wondering if we're supposed to remember Dev or not - I mean, for newcomers now, gobbling up the first two seasons in a few weeks, that's easy. But when it was airing... Would you remember the name of a rather brief appearance from two years ago? I don't know if I would.
I read (in Liberation which is OK for facts) that Del Tarrant was intended to be a traitor eventually* but they changed their mind. So maybe the whole Dev/Del Tarrant thing was intentional. They have to be related what with another De* Tarrant.
* As a newbie I spent all of S3 and S4 assuming Del was a Federation plant because of Dev, and there was quite a bit to support that (which I've used in fic).
I'm curious about whether Zen really would have given them away by answering that line though? After all, they usually (if not always) preface their initial questions to the computer with its name ("ZEN, what's our course and speed" etc.) Logically enough, as Zen does not automatically try to answer all and any questions ever spoken out loud on the flight-deck.*
*Ahaha, or maybe I just found the solution as to why everyone keeps excessively and superfluously calling each other by name in this show: they're doing it to let any voice-activated computer that might be around know they're not talking to it, so they won't accidentally give it all kinds of weird instructions. *g*Dayna is awesome! (So awesome that they ( ... )
Reply
If I'd been Vila, I'd be long gone.
Reply
Which is not to say that I don't think they all should have treated him better, particularly in front of outsiders. But I don't think Avon ( ... )
Reply
Cally is fond of Vila--she was glad to see him on Chenga--but yes, she's often very dismissive, especially at the end of City at the Edge.
It's no wonder Vila was depressed. I'd have bolted at the first chance, and he had some. He could have teleported to any planet they were near and thrown away his bracelet, and he obviously was capable of flying Scorpio alone. Maybe his will was completely sapped by then.
Reply
Reply
I doubt people would have recognised him--their images seem to have been officially suppressed (to avoid hero-worship?) but yes, he couldn't be what all his self-esteem rests on.
I'm intrigued by how strong Vila is when he thinks Avon is dead in 'Gold'. He often acts and takes charge when no one else is there to do so (Terminal) and perhaps here it's a combo of the situation changing and not having Avon to make decisions (and belittle him). I've read a few "Vila takes over" fics, but I think it would have to be in circumstances where no one else could, and I also wonder how long he'd sustain it.
I've been a fan for 12 years now (!!!) and I still love him. No apologies; I love to discuss him and B7 in general.
Reply
Reply
He's also quite practised at fitting in and making connections with people like Gan (a good choice) and Doran (definitely not one) but Doran, a very dangerous and nasty type, actually liked him, so I can see Vila doing OK with fellow criminals and prisoners and forming protective alliances. His manner and sense of humour just didn't fit in with most of the Liberator crew, though I think he really enjoyed having a real sparring partner in Avon.
I would read that S5!
I often feel embarrassed that my replies are too short!
Reply
Reply
Reply
but Doran, a very dangerous and nasty type, actually liked himHe does seem to have a talent to get the most unpleasant types to like him (Egrorian is another example) which seems very telling. After all, I think Vila's abhorrence of violence is perhaps one of his most "true" and unfaked personality traits, so it simply can't be that he somehow condones it in these people, or is so used to it that he doesn't care. But I imagine that going into “hero mode” and confronting them has never been a realistic option for him; nor avoiding them. So he does the ( ... )
Reply
It's not the case for Egrorian, but Doran's also the sort of person who'd get Vila's humour, honed on people very like him back on Earth. What works for them just doesn't for the Liberator people who grew up in different environments. OTOH Vila learns quickly enough that Avon is appreciative of witty banter. Maybe the others just don't have as much of a sense of humour.
Reply
Reply
I've always been troubled by Del an Dev. And I am sure he has a brother later, doesn’t he?
Vila in this episode is just an implosion of woobie cuteness. His invisible army of men gives me the sad giggles every time.
Reply
Deeta, I think? :-) I keep wondering if we're supposed to remember Dev or not - I mean, for newcomers now, gobbling up the first two seasons in a few weeks, that's easy. But when it was airing... Would you remember the name of a rather brief appearance from two years ago? I don't know if I would.
Reply
* As a newbie I spent all of S3 and S4 assuming Del was a Federation plant because of Dev, and there was quite a bit to support that (which I've used in fic).
Reply
Leave a comment