The Boys are Back in Town
Woo-hoo, I've finished my vid! It's Thin Lizzy's The Boys are Back in Town, and of course it's Angel and Spike and Spike and Angel and William and Angelus(with a few brief appearances by other characters). I'm feeling smug about it, because it is SO MUCH BETTER than my first ever effort, and because I got very worried halfway through that the idea
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Thank you! I enjoyed doing it, because most of the time the punches hit the beats anyway, without me having to faff about sorting it out, so it wasn’t nearly as difficult as I’d been expecting. There’s a lot of serendipity involved because I’m far too impatient to do any proper preaparatory work, I just sit down and get on with it, and then it’s often a matter of luck whether things fit or not.
Quite randomly, it was odd seeing the Spike/William scenes from FFL juxtaposed with the ones from TGIQ. Young Spike in FFL was kinda hot. TGIQ? Not so much...
It’s partly the lighting on Angel, I think, that doesn’t do JM any favours. But you know, in S5/early S6 he is quite extraordinarily beautiful, and Buffy having a big female audience, I think they really played with that, whereas AtS is more manly, so they focus on prettying up the female characters. And yeah, I miss pretty Spike, too.
And my brain is wired weird, b/c while the Destiny scenes you used worked really well in the video, I couldn't help getting pulled to a more sober state of mind watching them, b/c I just thought there was so much raw pain in that fight between Spike and Angel, and those scenes just brought it back to mind.
One of the things I find really interesting about fan vids is how they work on two levels, the story told by the images, and the story told by the context we know the images come from. I couldn’t help being very aware of that this time, because while the looking-for-Buffy scenes fit the lyrics without any backstory required, the NFA scenes only fit the lyrics if you know that episode. It’s like fanfiction in that respect, it relies on the audience bringing a shared context.
It's been a while since I watched that episode, it's odd that scenes from it have that effect on me.
I didn’t really like Destiny - I’m not sure why, because on paper it sounds right up my alley - but rewatching it, I appreciated it much more, especially the fight at the end. As you say, so there’s so much pain there. Funnily enough, the one that really improved with rewatching was Just Rewards, in spite of the stupid is-Spike-evil sub-plot. And my love for TGiQ increases with every viewing :-)
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Did they really? That's kind of funny.
I really loved the parts where Spike was getting thrown around by Illyria to the lyrics about the chick, etc... cracked me the hell up.
It’s partly the lighting on Angel, I think, that doesn’t do JM any favours.
Yeah, there's that, but JM has definitely gotten older. Which isn't to say that older guys can't be hot, but it's changed his look a bit. Not to mention, I just hate the later William wig (TGIQ fixed it a little b/c it was looser) and love the FFL wig (most of the time - every now and then it seemed to sit funny on his head). And I do agree that JM hit some sort of magical peak in his physical beauty in S5/early S6. Or the makeup people did, I dunno =). Then he started losing a bit too much weight, and then magically aged like 10 years in one summer... yeah, maybe that was the lighting.
One of the things I find really interesting about fan vids is how they work on two levels, the story told by the images, and the story told by the context we know the images come from.
That's an interesting observation. I haven't watched enough fanvids to form any opinions myself, but you've got me curious now.
I didn’t really like Destiny - I’m not sure why, because on paper it sounds right up my alley - but rewatching it, I appreciated it much more, especially the fight at the end.
There's an interesting mix of opinions about this episode, from people calling it the Best Episode Ever, to those who call it the worst. Me, I liked the final fight enough that I think it tipped the whole thing into the good bucket for me, but I don't think it's the best episode ever. It's interesting that you didn't like it but aren't sure why - can't quite put your finger on what bugs you about it, eh?
I want to rewatch "Just Rewards" but my sister has my tapes, damnit! While the Spike-is-evil subplot was silly, I actually kind of enjoyed that moment of Spike gloating around Angel. It wasn't a pretty side of him, but JM pulled it off really nicely, and it hinted at Spike's real issues, even if he was just play-acting. But then, I like early S5 AtS better than most people (probably helps that I haven't been able to rewatch b/c my sister has had the tapes for ages).
Hmm. Not sure I can get on that plane now, but I think I'll go to the airport anyway. 9PM is just a ridiculously late flight when I've got little to do already at 3:45PM. Talk to you when I get back to CA! =)
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I think I could get quite boring on the subject. I've come to the conclusion that it's all a matter of sub-text. When you watch a fanvid, the images provide the lyrics with a sub-text, based on what you know about the characters and their story. There are some fanvids which don't aim for that, they just use the imagery to illustrate the text, pure and simple (for instance there was one recc'd on TWoP that was 'The Coward of the County' set to Buffy images. It sort of worked in that the vidder found an image to go with every line, but at the same time you knew that what you were being shown hadn't happened on the show (Buffy being raped by the Trio, for instance), so the imagery only worked as text, not as sub-text). In contrast to that, there's a vid, Jolene, that examines Harmony's love for Spike and her jealousy of Buffy. There, the images function as sub-text, so that you interpret the song as a comment on what happened in the show, rather than the pictures simply illustrating the song, and that, for me, is a crucial element in a good fanvid - that the visuals don't just illustrate the song, they make you re-interpret it as a comment on some aspect of the show. Catatonic's Unwell would be another good example, because it's such a wonderful insight into what it's like to be Insane!Spike.
There's an interesting mix of opinions about this episode, from people calling it the Best Episode Ever, to those who call it the worst.
Huh. I thought that honour was reserved for TGiQ? I'm really not sure what bugged me about Destiny, except maybe that it was too straightforward - the issues were all so overt, if you see what I mean. Though I thought it was really excellent that Spike won the fight and that that really knocked the stuffing out of Angel (if you'll pardon the Smile Time imagery).
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That's bizarre to me. So they take images from the show but use them to tell a whole different story?
It seems to me that you can't avoid the baggage from the show that people will carry with them when they see these images, so a good fanvid will take that pre-knowledge and context and use it to their advantage in the video. It's not quite like creating a music video from scratch in that respect. That Unwell one sounds interesting, though I can't remember if I've seen it or not. I've seen maybe 2-3 vids, but I don't remember which at this point since it was months ago.
As for Destiny, I've read a couple people over on alt.tv.angel who call it unadulterated dross, etc etc... I've actually not read that negative a reaction from others, but there is definitely a set of opinions out there that view that episode extremely negatively. Though I haven't quite figured out exactly what they hated about it, since most people state that opinion as if it's a well-known and widely-held opinion. I can see what you're saying about the lack of subtlety overall in the episode, though I thought there were quite a few layers in the fight scene (like I said, it was that scene that made the episode for me). Hey, btw, did you ever read my long review of the episode? It was one of my first posts on LJ, and I posted it on alt.tv.angel and morethanspike.com, but not on TWoP, IIRC. It's in my memories section if you're interested. I don't think it'll change your opinion of the episode, but that was how I viewed the episode.
Spike winning the fight was brilliant, IMO, for the way it advanced both his AND Angel's characters. Spike regained a confidence around Angel that he previously lacked, and no longer seemed to need to be constantly proving himself around him. And Angel - that self-doubt, the questioning of destiny and predestination...that's what Spike belonged on the show for (at least partly), IMO. And it fit in so well with what was going on from TCTONC and the whole move to W&H.
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Yup. It's really strange to watch, because part of my mind is screaming 'But that's not what happened!' and the other part is going 'Yeah, that sort of works.' Like, the part of Tommy's dad is 'played' by Principal Snyder, and it really does sort of work, but at the same time we all know that's Principal Snyder and not Xander's dad (I suspect the vid of having been made by one of those mad Xander fans, which doesn't help).
That Unwell one sounds interesting, though I can't remember if I've seen it or not.
I linked to it a couple of posts back, if you want to check it out. It's one of my very favourites.
Hey, btw, did you ever read my long review of the episode? It was one of my first posts on LJ, and I posted it on alt.tv.angel and morethanspike.com, but not on TWoP, IIRC.
I don't remember reading it, so I'll go and take a look tomorrow (it's after midnight here and I really should be in bed...). I agree with you that the fight scene is the heart of the ep - I would never have thought that they could tell so much through a fight. I've always tended to think of the fights as the price you have to pay for watching a genre TV show (apart from Buffy's fight on the Winnebago in Spiral, which I adore, and the slo-mo fight in TGiQ).
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Er? That's odd. I'm almost curious enough to check it out. Almost.
I agree with you that the fight scene is the heart of the ep - I would never have thought that they could tell so much through a fight.
IMO that was the first episode where I really felt like JM stepped fully into AtS Spike. In the early few episodes, I didn't always feel like he was 100% there. But in the fight scene in "Destiny" he really sold the pain/anger/betrayal/hatred/underlying desire for acknowledgment or respect... the flashbacks helped, but IMO it was the dialogue and JM's performance that really sold that scene. And I agree, it's impressive how much they told through that fight. You knew that a fight between Angel and Spike was inevitable. That they could make it so emotionally rich was wonderful.
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