this is one long comment.. i wonder if ashura-sama minds...tomoyohime8February 7 2008, 13:26:47 UTC
being from Clow Country would make him Sakura's sibling ^^;;
--missed that part. it would be very awkward, wouldn't it?
is ccs!clow reed different from trc!clow reed?
there's not much info on him, since he's already dead at the start of the series. but the question is THERE. esp since yuuko keeps making these references to a clow reed who helped her make soel and larg.
since trc!sakura has magic abilities, it isn't too unbelieveable that trc!clow reed also had powers.
so if trc and ccs clow are different, which one was yuuko talking about?
and are the clow who is saku's father, and the clow who is syaoran's ancestor (we're going with the statement that r!syaoran is not ccs!syaoran, despite the raitei shourai and the li clan sword) the same?
if they are, then sakura and syaoran would be relatives... really distant ones (like great...grandmother?! aunt?!)
the romance bit would be completely screwed if that were to happen.
so c!sakura body + r!sakura soul... you'd get someone who technically has never met real syaoran and yet has a body that loves a syaoran?
and then, if sakura was cloned BEFORE she lost her feathers, does that mean that HER memories are intact? since technically, it was c!sakura who paid the price for the wishes.
I don't mind, carry on the discussion! ♥ashura_samaFebruary 7 2008, 14:11:05 UTC
Yuuko specifically mentioned the CCS Clow in the vault scene, but never by name. Seeing as we've seen people who have the same (or at least same-sounding) family name as a known counterpart (I'm looking at Hanshin Sorata -- exact same -- and Piffle Tomoyo -- same sound -- here), it's not impossible that Clow had the same happen to him.
Well, depending on the mechanics of Clow's soul split in CCS, Sakura/Shaoran was already vaguely incestuous then, especially in the light of the fact that Clow, Eriol and Fujitaka have physical similarities.
The backstory between real Sakura and real Shaoran is looking so WTF-ish to me right now... Clow-ou's line makes me think that Shaoran was at least "promised" to Sakura, though he might not have had the chance to actually meet her before being captured. It also bugs me how Sakura-replica identified the real one as "Shaoran's Sakura". It wasn't the real Sakura who travelled with Shaoran and shielded him from being lynched and got herself stabbed twice because of him; it was the replica. Assuming that the only backstory between him and the real Sakura is his watching her through the eye he gave to other Shaoran, it would seem to me that Sakura-replica has more than earned the right to be his Sakura.
The price other Shaoran and Sakura-replica paid makes no sense if at least the real Sakura doesn't inherit the loss of her memories of (other) Shaoran. Yuuko charged Shaoran's relationship with Sakura, right? Well, since the Sakura in Yuuko's yard had existed for a grand total of about 20' when the deal was struck, one would ask: What relationship? Did Yuuko deceive other Shaoran into thinking she had taken his most important thing when in fact it was completely worthless? I'm not inclined to agree with that.
Re: I don't mind, carry on the discussion! ♥tomoyohime8February 7 2008, 14:40:48 UTC
i'm also considering the magical ability.
there's only one yuuko, right? (wata would collapse in a faint if there were more than one. ^_^) could it be that those with immeasurable power don't have to share?
and i think that the connection between ccs!saku and syao was negligible. syaoran isn't exactly a direct descendant, right? unless clow married and had children (trc family?!?! wtf?!)
it could be that that would be the price (the knowledge that you've sacrificed what was most important to you for the person you loved (basically the same thing in his case)- does that make sense?)
and if it really was the relationship, c!syaoran isn't really caring about saku (either)'s wellbeing right now, so you could say that their relationship has changed since then.
if you put r!syaoran into that picture, c!saku couldn't bring herself to consider r!syaoran as the syaoran she knew and loved, even if the one she loved was the copy.
So let's carry on then!!! ♥cutesherryFebruary 7 2008, 18:10:47 UTC
As far as we know, there is only one Yuuko in TRC/Holic. But we ignore if there might actually be others version of herself in other dimensions...?
In CCS, Clow Reed is a son of an english father and a chinese mother (she was a Li) : so Syaoran Li is a direct descendant of Clow Reed through the mother of CR. In the other hand, Fujitaka is Clow Reed's reincarnation and Sakura is his daughter...seeing how in TRC she is King Clow daughter (Fujitaka and CR share the same genetic then ended up giving birth to the exactly same children), I think we could say she is CR half daughter in CCS (?) So there really is nothing like 'incest' between SxS in CCS : they are too far part in the family tree ^^;;
Yuuko said to the real Syaoran, when he came to her, that on of the three prices he paid was his 'relationship' (together with Time and Freedom) and she also did mention more then once that the price they gave away were not as simple as they might seem at first sight... It's only logical to think that if R|Syao paid for the clone then the R|Saku might have *unconsciously* been made to pay too for her own clone but in the end, we really don't know : we will have to wait for the confrontation R|SyaoxR|Saku in the upcoming chapters
Re: I don't mind, carry on the discussion! ♥yamisakura38February 7 2008, 19:49:26 UTC
Wow... I have been out for half a day and these has transformed into massive headache for me~~ Well, this would probably be the only one I can response to ^^;;
Though as for C|Sakura arbitrary believed real-Sakura is R|Syaoran's most important person... I seriously don't know. How can she be so certain?? Just by his statement of "you consider 'that' Sakura as your most important come from your heart"?? And how did she know that "his Sakura is waiting for her"? If technically speaking, R|Sakura didn't even know his existance!! o.O At the back of my mind, I am hoping that R|Sakura since she still retained her memories/heart/power when she was put into the tube by FWR... is that C|Sakura "somehow" is able to contact/meet with R|Sakura and they actually have a heart-to-heart talk. At least, that would be a bit more convincing on C|Sakura's statement for real-Sakura being R|Syaoran's most important person!!
Well, the tube that Yuuko have, during earlier chapter, it was introduced to us next to the Fai's tattoo and Ginryuu. Can't we assume that that has something to do with C|Syaoran's price?? And when C|Sakura's soul "requested" to go to the dreamworld, it "mysteriously" ended up in Yuuko's tube?? The more I think about it, the more I think there IS a deeper meaning behind why Yuuko took the memories of Syaoran from the clone counterpart of Sakura!! I really think that Syaoran's relationship price may be related or used in the future in conjunction with saving R|Sakura [or could be helping R|Syaoran in a way].
--missed that part. it would be very awkward, wouldn't it?
is ccs!clow reed different from trc!clow reed?
there's not much info on him, since he's already dead at the start of the series. but the question is THERE. esp since yuuko keeps making these references to a clow reed who helped her make soel and larg.
since trc!sakura has magic abilities, it isn't too unbelieveable that trc!clow reed also had powers.
so if trc and ccs clow are different, which one was yuuko talking about?
and are the clow who is saku's father, and the clow who is syaoran's ancestor (we're going with the statement that r!syaoran is not ccs!syaoran, despite the raitei shourai and the li clan sword) the same?
if they are, then sakura and syaoran would be relatives... really distant ones (like great...grandmother?! aunt?!)
the romance bit would be completely screwed if that were to happen.
so c!sakura body + r!sakura soul... you'd get someone who technically has never met real syaoran and yet has a body that loves a syaoran?
and then, if sakura was cloned BEFORE she lost her feathers, does that mean that HER memories are intact? since technically, it was c!sakura who paid the price for the wishes.
Reply
Well, depending on the mechanics of Clow's soul split in CCS, Sakura/Shaoran was already vaguely incestuous then, especially in the light of the fact that Clow, Eriol and Fujitaka have physical similarities.
The backstory between real Sakura and real Shaoran is looking so WTF-ish to me right now... Clow-ou's line makes me think that Shaoran was at least "promised" to Sakura, though he might not have had the chance to actually meet her before being captured. It also bugs me how Sakura-replica identified the real one as "Shaoran's Sakura". It wasn't the real Sakura who travelled with Shaoran and shielded him from being lynched and got herself stabbed twice because of him; it was the replica. Assuming that the only backstory between him and the real Sakura is his watching her through the eye he gave to other Shaoran, it would seem to me that Sakura-replica has more than earned the right to be his Sakura.
The price other Shaoran and Sakura-replica paid makes no sense if at least the real Sakura doesn't inherit the loss of her memories of (other) Shaoran. Yuuko charged Shaoran's relationship with Sakura, right? Well, since the Sakura in Yuuko's yard had existed for a grand total of about 20' when the deal was struck, one would ask: What relationship? Did Yuuko deceive other Shaoran into thinking she had taken his most important thing when in fact it was completely worthless? I'm not inclined to agree with that.
Reply
there's only one yuuko, right? (wata would collapse in a faint if there were more than one. ^_^) could it be that those with immeasurable power don't have to share?
and i think that the connection between ccs!saku and syao was negligible. syaoran isn't exactly a direct descendant, right? unless clow married and had children (trc family?!?! wtf?!)
it could be that that would be the price (the knowledge that you've sacrificed what was most important to you for the person you loved (basically the same thing in his case)- does that make sense?)
and if it really was the relationship, c!syaoran isn't really caring about saku (either)'s wellbeing right now, so you could say that their relationship has changed since then.
if you put r!syaoran into that picture, c!saku couldn't bring herself to consider r!syaoran as the syaoran she knew and loved, even if the one she loved was the copy.
Reply
In CCS, Clow Reed is a son of an english father and a chinese mother (she was a Li) : so Syaoran Li is a direct descendant of Clow Reed through the mother of CR.
In the other hand, Fujitaka is Clow Reed's reincarnation and Sakura is his daughter...seeing how in TRC she is King Clow daughter (Fujitaka and CR share the same genetic then ended up giving birth to the exactly same children), I think we could say she is CR half daughter in CCS (?)
So there really is nothing like 'incest' between SxS in CCS : they are too far part in the family tree ^^;;
Yuuko said to the real Syaoran, when he came to her, that on of the three prices he paid was his 'relationship' (together with Time and Freedom) and she also did mention more then once that the price they gave away were not as simple as they might seem at first sight...
It's only logical to think that if R|Syao paid for the clone then the R|Saku might have *unconsciously* been made to pay too for her own clone but in the end, we really don't know : we will have to wait for the confrontation R|SyaoxR|Saku in the upcoming chapters
Reply
Though as for C|Sakura arbitrary believed real-Sakura is R|Syaoran's most important person... I seriously don't know. How can she be so certain?? Just by his statement of "you consider 'that' Sakura as your most important come from your heart"?? And how did she know that "his Sakura is waiting for her"? If technically speaking, R|Sakura didn't even know his existance!! o.O At the back of my mind, I am hoping that R|Sakura since she still retained her memories/heart/power when she was put into the tube by FWR... is that C|Sakura "somehow" is able to contact/meet with R|Sakura and they actually have a heart-to-heart talk. At least, that would be a bit more convincing on C|Sakura's statement for real-Sakura being R|Syaoran's most important person!!
Well, the tube that Yuuko have, during earlier chapter, it was introduced to us next to the Fai's tattoo and Ginryuu. Can't we assume that that has something to do with C|Syaoran's price?? And when C|Sakura's soul "requested" to go to the dreamworld, it "mysteriously" ended up in Yuuko's tube?? The more I think about it, the more I think there IS a deeper meaning behind why Yuuko took the memories of Syaoran from the clone counterpart of Sakura!! I really think that Syaoran's relationship price may be related or used in the future in conjunction with saving R|Sakura [or could be helping R|Syaoran in a way].
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Now, as to if King Clow and Clow Reed are the one and the same, I don't believe so.
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