Spoilers baby! (like HEAPS of them...)
There's been some pretty juicy spoilers come out over the last few days and I have been itching to chat about them. I have been fluctuating between feeling really excited and being filled with dread.
There's no doubt I WANT to be excited because that's a much happier place to be. So I'm going to try and remain up beat with my comments, but they will be tinged with a certain amount of caution because I feel like I've been pretty burned after the last season.
For those who are not sure if they want to check what the spoilers are, the first cut details what kind of spoilers to expect.
The spoilers contain information on what kind of demon Dean will be, about how long he might be a demon, how Dean feels about being a demon, what Sam will be doing as the season opens, what Sam may have to do to save Dean, how much time has passed from the S9 finale and what role Cas and Crowley will be playing. This obviously only covers the first few episodes.
If you are happy to be spoiled in these things....continue.
Here's a list of links to the spoilers:
Jared talks about Sam, Dean and More (from TV fanatic)
Carver talks about the S10 - Sam, Dean, Crowley and Cas (from TVLine)
More from Jared about what Sam will be up to (from Zap2it)
The type of episode #200 will be (eonline)
More from Carver about Sam and Dean's relationship going into S10 (Zap2it)
Jensen on directing and demon!Dean (Zap2it)
Also:
Jensen talks about Dean's relationship to Cas and Crowley in beginning of S10 (this is only part 1 of 3 so still more to come).
Jensen talks about directing ep 10.3 (a little spoilery about demon!Dean but mostly a great insight into his direction
Some thoughts:
I think there are some pretty interesting and exciting teasers here. It's wonderful that Jared, Jensen and Carver have given us a little bit of an idea of what to expect going into S10. I know that it's easy to read too much, or not the right thing in these, but I think it can be fun to speculate what we might be getting (and maybe even moan a little? I think that's ok too).
Dean
I am pretty damn excited about Demon!Dean I have to say - not least because it will be nice to see Jensen do something different, something that should be a nice challenge for him. I also really like the idea of the kind of demon Dean will be. He's not possessed, he's aware of who he is and "There’s a real period for Dean of deciding how dark he’s going to be and what kind of demon he’s going to be, because he can’t blame it on anyone else but himself." We could see some great introspection from Dean (without the heavy emotion) and it seems that once he's "un-demonised" he'll still be carrying that part of him around. I would argue that he started carrying that around during S9 and that played a part in creating the demon in the first place (certainly in accepting the Mark) - so this is all very interesting for Dean I think.
The idea that Crowley will not even know how to handle him adds some intrigue. Sounds like they might be besties for a while, but I think demon!Dean with the Mark is going to be a pretty unstoppable force. Hard to know for sure, because we don't know exactly what he'll be up to. What will he do that separates Dean from demon!Dean? Dean's already done some questionable things (including torturing innocent victims of possession), so I'm not sure what direction they take him in. Kill innocent people maybe? We know he'll be having sex so there's that to look forward to! (and I reckon, like soulless!Sam, we'll see a different side to Dean -possibly less caring...). I am fascinated by this "new character" (as Jensen says) and look forward to seeing how this plays out.
Sam
It's probably no surprise that it's Sam's storyline that worries me the most. I mean, I am much happier to read "Sam will be frantically looking for his brother" rather than "Sam doesn't even try to look for his brother". I am excited by that (at least we'll see the concern and love shine through) but it's some of those finer details that have my stomach churning.
Firstly though;
This fall, Sam Winchester will find himself in a place he's rarely been over the first nine seasons of Supernatural: he'll be the one to save his demon of a brother.
It's amuses me (and annoys me a little) that Sam is often spoken about as not ever saving Dean. He was the first brother to save the other from certain death. Faith (1.12) saw Sam seek out a faith healer. His actions lead to the death of an innocent man and threatened another. When Dean went to Hell Sam did everything he could to bring Dean back. It started him on a dark path and even though he failed to save Dean, he believed he able to at least revenge what happened to him. It could also be argued that by jumping in the pit Sam saved Dean (and the world) from Lucifer's reign (which promised to be apocalyptic). I realise this refers to the "big" save and I think because Sam didn't save (or even try to save) Dean from purgatory in S8 he's remembered mostly for that I think. It's probably also about the times Sam "failed" to save Dean, rather than those times he actually did.
But this is the line that has me wondering what the hell they are going to make Sam do (and why!!!!???!)
Sam is so invested in finding his brother that it leads him to do some questionable things that will make him and, certainly, the audience wonder which one of these guys is the true monster.
On the one hand this has HUGE potential because it could mirror Dean's "questionable" decision to allow an angel to possess Sam. But I don't get the feeling that it's about that. Carver has never said that Dean make a questionable choice (not that I know of anyway) and the Show never made a point of it last season. So it looks like Sam will be doing something that will be monstrous to the point that we can't tell the difference between him and a demon. That saddens me greatly I have to say. What I love about Sam is his caring nature and that he seems to understand (since S9 anyway) there are some lines you don't cross. I mean, wasn't that at least part of what early S8 and much of S9 was about? It seems the show is saying these boys are not much different to the monsters they hunt. On the one hand that's kind of awesome (how could they be hunters and not be touched by all that evil) but on the other hand...where are the heroes we fell in love with? How long will be have to see this darkness in them? The whole season?
Don't get me wrong. The Slash Fiction (Leviathan) version of the Winchesters was damn sexy and fascinating, but psycho Winchesters might only be fun for a short period of time. Though maybe it takes monsters to hunt monsters.
I just wonder why Dean can't be a demon and Sam just be...well, Sam? Frantic sure, but not having learned anything from their past? But that's the part I will have to wait for. We've seen desperate Sam in the past and in both cases he made questionable choices. In S4 he drank demon blood, slept with a demon and killed an innocent vessel for her blood and in mystery spot seemed very dark and ended up killing "Bobby". As soulless!Sam he actually did attempt to kill the real Bobby. I just wonder what on earth they could have Sam do above those things that make him as much of a monster as Dean? Kill a child? Lead a demon army (ooooh, that might be a nice twist!! And a nice call-back to the beginning).
So, I have mixed feeling about the Sam spoilers. It could be awesome, but to be honest Carver worries me a lot when it comes to Sam. I'm not convinced he has a real handle on him (especially after the Amelia story line, the "not look at all" story line, the "being possessed without any personal trauma" storyline and the "say mean things to Dean as part of a plot device" storyline).
I'm also a bit saddened to find out that the "I'm proud of us" WAS a reconciliation. Carver says the boys reconciled in the finale and their relationship is not on better ground Which, ok, YAY (no idea how that works with demon!Dean), but also...SERIOUSLY?! a whole season of disconnect and a butt load of hurt and 4 words cures it all? (maybe because they are Winchesters we just have to accept that that IS all it takes...) I'm going to assume (and hope) that many of the issues raised in S9 WILL be address a little bit in S10. Please? Not too much to ask is it? At least explore the cost (to each other and others) of their sacrifices for each other.
Other stuff
I'm not tooooo unhappy that Cas seems to be carrying his own storyline - at least for a few eps. Metatron is still around and looks like Cas will be on a quest for his grace. I hope all that will be interesting but it's not part of the story that particularly grips me. I wouldn't mind seeing Cas and Sam work together to help Dean, but it sounds like that's not happening (at least in the beginning). It's bizarre though. They set up Team Free Will and Cas feels that "Sam has his own problems so he can't ask him to help him find his grace". Maybe they could help each other with their respective problems? I am sure their story lines will collide at some point. It will also be very weird if we don't have some reaction from Cas about Dean. As much as I have come to dread anything that means Dean and Cas share a screen (that's another discussion...), it would be strange if Cas doesn't feature somewhere in Dean's troubles.
I always want to go into a season without expectations. I don't want to "hope" for anything because I like to be surprised and not disappointed. But I can't help to want a few things in S10. Mostly that Sam isn't made to do something so horrible that Dean ends up pissed at him (again) or that he has to redeem himself (again), or that what he does to save Dean makes what Dean did to save Sam in S9 pale in significance. But I suppose if that happens fans can have a "real" reason to pile hate on him - rather than just because he spoke out against his treatment (oh shut up. I will always be bitterly bitter about that...;D)
Oh and also? Musical ep? Really? Hehe...oh fandom. You asked for it!
Is it October yet? I can't believe we still have to wait 2 more whole months!!
ETA: ooh, something else I wanted to include because it majorly confused me. This from Carver:
So what's the big theme for the season?
"This might sound mysterious," says Carver, "but to me, Season 9 was about choosing the kind of person you wanted to be, like Cas deciding whether to stay human or become an angel again. I think Season 10 will be about everyone looking up and saying, 'You know what, I am what I am.' We'll see that play out in each and every character."
Um...choosing the kind of person you wanted to be? It felt exactly the opposite to me. All characters were forced to be something they really aren't. Cas - a human, Crowley - a human, Sam- possessed by an angel and Dean - carrying the Mark of Cain without knowing what it really was. I wouldn't have said Cas had much choice at all about remaining human. Well, he could have and died I suppose - so no choice really.
So S10 about "I am what I am"? So - I'm a monster so suck it!
Yeah - I'd rather not take Carver's work on what these seasons are about. I'm not sure if he actually watched them.
There's no doubt I WANT to be excited because that's a much happier place to be. So I'm going to try and remain up beat with my comments, but they will be tinged with a certain amount of caution because I feel like I've been pretty burned after the last season.
For those who are not sure if they want to check what the spoilers are, the first cut details what kind of spoilers to expect.
The spoilers contain information on what kind of demon Dean will be, about how long he might be a demon, how Dean feels about being a demon, what Sam will be doing as the season opens, what Sam may have to do to save Dean, how much time has passed from the S9 finale and what role Cas and Crowley will be playing. This obviously only covers the first few episodes.
If you are happy to be spoiled in these things....continue.
Here's a list of links to the spoilers:
Jared talks about Sam, Dean and More (from TV fanatic)
Carver talks about the S10 - Sam, Dean, Crowley and Cas (from TVLine)
More from Jared about what Sam will be up to (from Zap2it)
The type of episode #200 will be (eonline)
More from Carver about Sam and Dean's relationship going into S10 (Zap2it)
Jensen on directing and demon!Dean (Zap2it)
Also:
Jensen talks about Dean's relationship to Cas and Crowley in beginning of S10 (this is only part 1 of 3 so still more to come).
Jensen talks about directing ep 10.3 (a little spoilery about demon!Dean but mostly a great insight into his direction
Some thoughts:
I think there are some pretty interesting and exciting teasers here. It's wonderful that Jared, Jensen and Carver have given us a little bit of an idea of what to expect going into S10. I know that it's easy to read too much, or not the right thing in these, but I think it can be fun to speculate what we might be getting (and maybe even moan a little? I think that's ok too).
Dean
I am pretty damn excited about Demon!Dean I have to say - not least because it will be nice to see Jensen do something different, something that should be a nice challenge for him. I also really like the idea of the kind of demon Dean will be. He's not possessed, he's aware of who he is and "There’s a real period for Dean of deciding how dark he’s going to be and what kind of demon he’s going to be, because he can’t blame it on anyone else but himself." We could see some great introspection from Dean (without the heavy emotion) and it seems that once he's "un-demonised" he'll still be carrying that part of him around. I would argue that he started carrying that around during S9 and that played a part in creating the demon in the first place (certainly in accepting the Mark) - so this is all very interesting for Dean I think.
The idea that Crowley will not even know how to handle him adds some intrigue. Sounds like they might be besties for a while, but I think demon!Dean with the Mark is going to be a pretty unstoppable force. Hard to know for sure, because we don't know exactly what he'll be up to. What will he do that separates Dean from demon!Dean? Dean's already done some questionable things (including torturing innocent victims of possession), so I'm not sure what direction they take him in. Kill innocent people maybe? We know he'll be having sex so there's that to look forward to! (and I reckon, like soulless!Sam, we'll see a different side to Dean -possibly less caring...). I am fascinated by this "new character" (as Jensen says) and look forward to seeing how this plays out.
Sam
It's probably no surprise that it's Sam's storyline that worries me the most. I mean, I am much happier to read "Sam will be frantically looking for his brother" rather than "Sam doesn't even try to look for his brother". I am excited by that (at least we'll see the concern and love shine through) but it's some of those finer details that have my stomach churning.
Firstly though;
This fall, Sam Winchester will find himself in a place he's rarely been over the first nine seasons of Supernatural: he'll be the one to save his demon of a brother.
It's amuses me (and annoys me a little) that Sam is often spoken about as not ever saving Dean. He was the first brother to save the other from certain death. Faith (1.12) saw Sam seek out a faith healer. His actions lead to the death of an innocent man and threatened another. When Dean went to Hell Sam did everything he could to bring Dean back. It started him on a dark path and even though he failed to save Dean, he believed he able to at least revenge what happened to him. It could also be argued that by jumping in the pit Sam saved Dean (and the world) from Lucifer's reign (which promised to be apocalyptic). I realise this refers to the "big" save and I think because Sam didn't save (or even try to save) Dean from purgatory in S8 he's remembered mostly for that I think. It's probably also about the times Sam "failed" to save Dean, rather than those times he actually did.
But this is the line that has me wondering what the hell they are going to make Sam do (and why!!!!???!)
Sam is so invested in finding his brother that it leads him to do some questionable things that will make him and, certainly, the audience wonder which one of these guys is the true monster.
On the one hand this has HUGE potential because it could mirror Dean's "questionable" decision to allow an angel to possess Sam. But I don't get the feeling that it's about that. Carver has never said that Dean make a questionable choice (not that I know of anyway) and the Show never made a point of it last season. So it looks like Sam will be doing something that will be monstrous to the point that we can't tell the difference between him and a demon. That saddens me greatly I have to say. What I love about Sam is his caring nature and that he seems to understand (since S9 anyway) there are some lines you don't cross. I mean, wasn't that at least part of what early S8 and much of S9 was about? It seems the show is saying these boys are not much different to the monsters they hunt. On the one hand that's kind of awesome (how could they be hunters and not be touched by all that evil) but on the other hand...where are the heroes we fell in love with? How long will be have to see this darkness in them? The whole season?
Don't get me wrong. The Slash Fiction (Leviathan) version of the Winchesters was damn sexy and fascinating, but psycho Winchesters might only be fun for a short period of time. Though maybe it takes monsters to hunt monsters.
I just wonder why Dean can't be a demon and Sam just be...well, Sam? Frantic sure, but not having learned anything from their past? But that's the part I will have to wait for. We've seen desperate Sam in the past and in both cases he made questionable choices. In S4 he drank demon blood, slept with a demon and killed an innocent vessel for her blood and in mystery spot seemed very dark and ended up killing "Bobby". As soulless!Sam he actually did attempt to kill the real Bobby. I just wonder what on earth they could have Sam do above those things that make him as much of a monster as Dean? Kill a child? Lead a demon army (ooooh, that might be a nice twist!! And a nice call-back to the beginning).
So, I have mixed feeling about the Sam spoilers. It could be awesome, but to be honest Carver worries me a lot when it comes to Sam. I'm not convinced he has a real handle on him (especially after the Amelia story line, the "not look at all" story line, the "being possessed without any personal trauma" storyline and the "say mean things to Dean as part of a plot device" storyline).
I'm also a bit saddened to find out that the "I'm proud of us" WAS a reconciliation. Carver says the boys reconciled in the finale and their relationship is not on better ground Which, ok, YAY (no idea how that works with demon!Dean), but also...SERIOUSLY?! a whole season of disconnect and a butt load of hurt and 4 words cures it all? (maybe because they are Winchesters we just have to accept that that IS all it takes...) I'm going to assume (and hope) that many of the issues raised in S9 WILL be address a little bit in S10. Please? Not too much to ask is it? At least explore the cost (to each other and others) of their sacrifices for each other.
Other stuff
I'm not tooooo unhappy that Cas seems to be carrying his own storyline - at least for a few eps. Metatron is still around and looks like Cas will be on a quest for his grace. I hope all that will be interesting but it's not part of the story that particularly grips me. I wouldn't mind seeing Cas and Sam work together to help Dean, but it sounds like that's not happening (at least in the beginning). It's bizarre though. They set up Team Free Will and Cas feels that "Sam has his own problems so he can't ask him to help him find his grace". Maybe they could help each other with their respective problems? I am sure their story lines will collide at some point. It will also be very weird if we don't have some reaction from Cas about Dean. As much as I have come to dread anything that means Dean and Cas share a screen (that's another discussion...), it would be strange if Cas doesn't feature somewhere in Dean's troubles.
I always want to go into a season without expectations. I don't want to "hope" for anything because I like to be surprised and not disappointed. But I can't help to want a few things in S10. Mostly that Sam isn't made to do something so horrible that Dean ends up pissed at him (again) or that he has to redeem himself (again), or that what he does to save Dean makes what Dean did to save Sam in S9 pale in significance. But I suppose if that happens fans can have a "real" reason to pile hate on him - rather than just because he spoke out against his treatment (oh shut up. I will always be bitterly bitter about that...;D)
Oh and also? Musical ep? Really? Hehe...oh fandom. You asked for it!
Is it October yet? I can't believe we still have to wait 2 more whole months!!
ETA: ooh, something else I wanted to include because it majorly confused me. This from Carver:
So what's the big theme for the season?
"This might sound mysterious," says Carver, "but to me, Season 9 was about choosing the kind of person you wanted to be, like Cas deciding whether to stay human or become an angel again. I think Season 10 will be about everyone looking up and saying, 'You know what, I am what I am.' We'll see that play out in each and every character."
Um...choosing the kind of person you wanted to be? It felt exactly the opposite to me. All characters were forced to be something they really aren't. Cas - a human, Crowley - a human, Sam- possessed by an angel and Dean - carrying the Mark of Cain without knowing what it really was. I wouldn't have said Cas had much choice at all about remaining human. Well, he could have and died I suppose - so no choice really.
So S10 about "I am what I am"? So - I'm a monster so suck it!
Yeah - I'd rather not take Carver's work on what these seasons are about. I'm not sure if he actually watched them.