Vividcon 2015 Panel Notes (part 2)
Here are my panel notes (part 2) for Vividcon 2015. I did my best at hearing and typing as accurately as I could but these are not perfect transcriptions. If you see something and want it corrected (or credit), feel free to let me know as I'd love for it to be more accurate.
Life After Vidding
Mod: vagabondage and
pipsqueaky
-youre vidding and you had a great time vidding and then you stop and cant vid
-its okay to have your vidding mojo wear out
-split into three parts, the therapy part, it gets very depressing, very frustrating, its a terrible hobby, my mojo dried up for 6 years and all of a sudden i started vidding again
-my mojo has not returned yet, its been four years now, im being okay with this, will my vidder friends still hang out with me, i come to vividcon and enjoy talking about it, ive reached a zen place
-i feel if im not vidding, i cant participate, if i dont have my vidding mojo i have nothing
-i know people when they are vidding, cant watch vids, other people when theyre vidding will watch other vids to steal ideas or be inspired
-when you cant vid, one of the best ways to vid is pick a song, pick an episode of a tv, just start grabbing clips, oh i love that scene, its so pretty and throw it on the timeline, your brain gets past the point of i cant vid, youre vidding even if its a piece of crap
-i have more vidding mojo after i finish vids, i get all excited, your creative juices are flowing
-anything that hasnt worked? i tried to slow the earths rotation
-have stopped because i didnt have time, also emotional, not enough room left for vidding
-i was trying to make a vid, it was just work, one more thing i had to force myself to do, instead of forgetting to pee, i used it to take breaks
-if its not fun then why am i doing it, theres different kinds of fun, when im exhausted and im short on time, the kind of fun i want is pringles fun, im going to fuck around on tumblr because theres no effort, with vidding i have to sit down and do stuff to make stuff happen, pringles as opposed to make a good meal for myself that i have to spend half hour in kitchen for
-the longer i go without releasing vids, i feel like im falling behind everybody else, community is going this way and im standing all the way back there
-i came off a two year hiatus, if im going to make something i have to continue my learning trajectory...
-being able to ditch that concept was how i was able to get back into vids, i had four year hiatus actually and the first vid i made after it wasnt ambitious, it wasnt a statement, you can just make a vid to something you like, after that i made 7 festivids [absolutedestiny]
-if you can get that vid out, every vid does not have to be a masterpiece, if you can puke one out the rest will follow
-give yourself permission to make vids for yourself that no one else needs to see
-have someone come over and vid together either in person or online, get a personal cheerleader, just put that song in the timeline and throw some clips on timeline, then think of making something serious
-we are our own worse critics, when i come back it needs to be big and bold and friends will say no, just put some clips on the timeline
-after you make that first vid, you dont like the vid, any advice?
-...exposure exercise, heres what im afraid of, what is the irrational voice saying and then do it anyways, take small steps and do it anyway even though the voice says youre stupid, tell it to fuck off
-i was afraid to learn a new way to vid, i used to do old fashioned capture, still when im making a vid i will have to talk to 2-3 different people, someone talk me through it, get a buddy, get a vid buddy
-the other thing to do, if you try all this and it doesnt work, its OKAY, you dont have to vid, i dont have any vids this year for the first time and im okay with it, im really happy with other aspects of my life, im finally doing what i wanted to do all my life, i have other goals, my creative energy is going to those, ive been putting pressure on myself to do it and it feels like a chore, if you dont have a vid in premieres youre not a real vidder: thats not true
-the thing that overrides should be...new fandom or revisiting an old idea, not i need to make these 5 year old fandoms, find something new and shiny, its my way of being in this community...
-everytime ive had a gap or break, ive broken the hiatus by making a movie vid
-when you feel like you want to vid but the ideas arent there, on whatever social media youre on, tell your friends to toss you vid ideas or what fandoms and what songs they like and put them together and see what comes
-just look at festivids requests, dont sign up, just make a treat
-if you have a hiatus and then you get into a hot new fandom, it can be stressful, when you first vid, it might take you awhile to make that vid, omg theyve already vidded this thing
-i love this fandom, everyone else is making the same vids, why should i bother?, make it,
-it can be new to you, everyone who still loves the fandom, everyone will fall over themselves
-the people who loved the fandom back then are starving for vids...
-does anyone really need this, i had a bucky/steve idea, do we really need another one, are vids a thing that people need, existential
-yes there needs to be another vid for x/x because you like it...remember its fun
-i never get tired about watching a million vids to my favorite characters...
-my one time i vid is for vividcon and this is an intimidating place, i come out saying, i want to vid, later and its a vicious cycle
-the concom hates it, not every vid in vividcon has to be amazing because we've had a couple good years, no make your vid, put it into premieres, its good enough, someone out there will love it, every vid has an audience out there somewhere
-someone loves the luke/hermione vid unironically
-im going to stand up for that vid because it provides years of happiness
-its not like other people are saying it has to be great for vividcon, im doing it myself
-youre being too nice, a con is an opportunity to show a vid to an audience who cant get away from it
-im going to MAKE you guys watch it
-i dont feel like vidding anything but watch this small fandom that no one will watch online but you have to watch it
-maybe if we werent so harsh at vid review, people wouldnt feel that way about Premieres, after vid review some people feel like suicide, if you cant handle negativity, dont go to vid review
-vid review is not for vidder, its for the audience, death of the author
-bringing vids to a con is a brave thing to do, this con is not your audience, they may not care, they may have issues with your vid, its hugely brave
-we tend to conflate vidding and vividcon in our community, our cycles are around vividcon and festivids with deadlines, i cant put my vid out there and what if i put it out there and no one likes it, you can make a vid for yourself, for a friend, outside of them
-i want to make a vid but im too afraid, thats what challenge is for, you can be anonymous
-ive not made a vid thats not for festivids or vividcon
-sometimes signing up and committing vids to festivids or vvc can help get you to do it...
-i still think of you as a vidder because youve made vids i love, but for myself i think im not a vidder, i cant claim it
-if youve made a vid, youre a vidder, if you dont make vids, youre still important, if youre telling us how much you love the vid...
-for festivids treats, if it existed one person would be incredibly happy and it was liberating...
-so many people will pee their pants with joy if you make that vid for festivids fandom, it doesnt have to be a masterpiece
-some of my most satisfying vids were my first three years in festivids...
-i love concrit, i love to hear what people say
-not signing up for festivids, i signed up for back to the future to tik tok and its the only vid i still like
-i have trouble finding songs that anyone other than me will like, list of songs for club vivid that people want, having that list helped make it possible for me to vid
-trouble finding song: ask people, try IRC vidding chatroom, its really easy, plenty of clients to download, great place to ask for songs, im thinking of making this vid, anyone need help
-spotify: search for pre-curated playlists, also related artists of songs
-cdbaby is a great place, small artists, half the time theyre happy that someone knows about them
-i made this club vivid vid to prince and it was super fast shut down
-artists may link vids on twitter with smaller fanbases to expose to wider audience
-some people will post your vid and take your name off of it
-when i have a vid when i want to use lyrics, i will literally google for lyrics like "i will be there for you"
-more than anything, finding support is important, find someone in here and look for support, email, both of you can come up with clip to throw on the timeline
-i think with adobe creative cloud will keep things in the cloud so multiple people can access
-lay a bunch of clips on the timeline with no music, the song can come after, sometimes the music comes first and sometimes lyrics with composing music, you can even switch songs and modify your vid
-a lot of my vids have come from using a song i knew wasnt right and working with the clips helps me figure out what the right song is
-because the majority of what we work for is 4/4 time, its probably going to fit
-make your own mashups until you find something that works
-you dont have to feel like you dont contribute to fandom because you can no longer produce, people leave fandom because they dont create, its not about what we make, its about what we love
-it helped when i was not a vidder for years, please dont insult all the people like me that when youre not vidding, youre not part of the community...you can be one of us for awhile
-ive used up all my ideas, i cant learn new vid tech, then hear song and ask for help guys, teach me how to vid, even if you cant afford new tech there are plenty of ways to help you get free tech and source, people will help you find them
-its doesnt matter what the conclusion of your vidding dry spell is...i havent vidded at all since 2011, im not planning on vidding again but im still going to come to vividcon, im still part of the community
-it makes me crazy that people will abandon something they love because they feel theyre not doing enough, we're all here for each other, yeah we can help each other make the vids but you dont have to..., dont be resentful about fandom
-one of my big motivators, read previous comments on older vids, if im doubting myself, i read the comments and people like my vids, am i insulting commenters because i think my vid is crap
-i like reading comments because it tells me i can do things, if it turns ok...you just have to wait for the person who sees your vid and thinks your vid is amazing
-since we've all made these vids, leave comments on people's vids, it can just be a smile, you dont have to do deep analysis
-i love the ways you arrange the clips to the music...i love them, thank you i had a lot of fun doing that
-we're all part of the community, we all love and support each other, if you see someone struggling help them out, if you dont have any ideas, hook them up with a friend who loves music and can give song suggestions, if you come out of here and its helped you unblock, great and if you come out of here still blocked, thats fabulous
Stop, Collaborate and Listen
Mod: jarrow
-the idea is for this to be different from past panels, much of the time 2/3 of it will be activity based, untested experiment, lets talk about what collaboration is
-collaboration is two or more people together working on a vid, doesnt have to be in the same location, doesnt mean you're my beta, making clip choices together, one person can drive (do the actual vid work) and other is not, that works out fine except when it doesnt
-what are some things that worked well in collaboration
-it helps me to get unstuck, pass it back and forth, your turn, tag you're it
-collaboration for multifandom vid, helpful to split up the research
-you will always find the other person will know things that you do not know
-when playing out the structure, helps the planning process, helps to solidify the ideas, helps to have someone to talk it out with
-as a fellow extrovert it helps me to talk about it
-instant beta feedback to tell when something is not working, dont need to keep emailing back and forth, theyre right there with you
-its fun!!! we made this together, its our baby, it can look like both of us but it looks more like you
-they do the hard tech parts (usually absolutedestiny)
-laurashapiro was able to do the credits and jarrow could help out with tech
-when youre in the flow and you need a clip and you can have someone else find the clip for you so you dont have to fall out of the good part of vidding, you dont lose your vidding mojo
-go get constipated angel and then partner can get it
-different skill sets allows vid to have more expertise going into it versus just one person, different styles can go into it, there can be more variety, different knowledge, different skills
-anything to do with a friend, brought me closer to friend
-what are the things that have not worked, certain challenges that come along with a collaboration
-you have to speak up for yourself and not let yourself get dominated, especially if its a friend and you dont want to hurt their precious feelings
-conflicting vision for the vid
-being able to say, that clip you put in, does not work, kill your darling, im fine with everything but this one clip and maybe thats their favorite clip
-there has to be compromise, you can take out one clip and ill take out one of your clips
-coordinating between tech, my computer doesnt even get along with its own tech
-it can be hard to communicate, we did one together, i was running the tech and she kept saying, move the clip over two frames, i have no idea what your problem with this is, especially if you use two different tech systems or youre tired
-if we know how to put things into words, we wouldn't be vidders
-im telling you exactly how to fix it and youre not understanding, i know this is not right but i dont know what it should be, i know its not quite that, i dont know the fix
-started the collaboration and realize our styles dont match well, we'd be better friends, incompatibility
-if you have two people used to being project leaders, two alphas, it can be tough
-when your collaboration partner isnt pulling their weight, you want to work on the vid, theyre not communicative, theyre not around, youre doing all the work of the collaboration, havent heard from them in 3 weeks
-my J for Myers-Briggs, i havent heard from you...
-you are super pressuring me right now, i am having a life and ill get to it later
-two vidders enter, one vid leaves (no death), we are going to be talking to each other, you dont have to speak if you have social anxiety, we want to expand the idea of collaboration to these other things, help me find a song, be my beta, help with tech, theres a vid where theres something we need that we dont have
-if youre not at vividcon, how do you seek help, is there a secret place
-theres a convention called wiscon that puts together an older vidder and younger vidder, sometimes it works and sometimes it doesnt, if you email them they can help
-ask your friends, talk to here's luck or way2busymom, they have lots of songs, gave fan_eunice many songs even if its not a collaboration
-theres a large population of people who are frightened of software but have vid ideas, if you can drive, lets make your vid, tell me your ideas and i can make it, can help find people who arent in the vidding community
-even if you dont find your perfect match, there will be vids that get made because of the next twenty minutes
-checklist of things you might need: song, tech, partner, help developing a concept, beta, cheerleading, source
-you dont always know what youre going to do in terms of agreeing to beta, help collaborate because it can depend on an idea, dont want to be awkward to say no to somebody
Vidding Doctor Who
Mod:
milly
-challenge to vid because so much source, same character but many different actors, a lot of challenges with doing it because a lot of people will connect differently to a story, not everyone is familiar with all the source, new who fans didnt watch classic who, doctor who is spread out 50 years with black and white to very sparkly stuff, vidding wise its fun to play with
-ex. Not Done With My Changes by kass
[was out of room]
ex. Take On Me by trelkez
-one thing with this vid is it has a very specific structure, it starts out with old school, heres the doctor, then follows 9, 10 and 11 chronologically, only times doctor comes back is later on in vid to give history especially during regeneration, it makes it look more epic, it avoids the constant changing of source quality, helps the eye not jump from one to the other, some people dont have issues but i do with quality, it might depend on when you started watching, interesting way to present the doctor without going around the obstacle, also great cvv vid
-another way to vid the doctor is each number is his own person, blurry on the show whether doctor is different, your music choice and narrative is going to be affected, not as much as 9 and 10 but 11 has their own visual quality, there are some people who have never seen doctor who and dont understand so it helps to just have a vid about one doctor but you lose out on the rich history
ex. Love is Cool by such_heights and purple_fringe
-team 11 vid, this vid is only 11, amy and rory arent with other doctors but river had interactions with 10 which was not referred to at all, its completely distinct from 10, its how fandom usually looks at him, doctor who is one of the fandoms where you go, thats my doctor, in vidding you have vids that present them as very distinct, vids are focused on one aspect of the doctor that still refer to past
-ex. Ghost by morgandawn
-in this one, morgandawn used promotional footage when doctor who was coming back, it was just narration of 9 running down this corridor, the whole theme of the vid of ghost but it also has this layer of all the people he's left behind, it gives us the richness of the character, i dont know if it was done today with the special of the time wars, would you consider promotional source external? not really, its like using a deleted scene, it doesnt contradict anything, it can be used as a metaphor, running away from past with explosions, here's 11 with all the companions and you can also just focus on just one character
-...do i just use 9 and Rose or 10 and Rose or both, doctor who broke my dry spell, i have a friend who didnt watch doctor who but didnt know what my vid meant after, i didnt handle that well, she didnt get that the character was the same person
-ex. Be Yourself by milly
-my friend (hadnt seen doctor who) watched this vid, thats kind of sad, thats interesting, whats sad...after i explained regeneration, i dont think i would have guessed that from vid, theres always going to be a barrier, people will miss some subtleties, but they probably wont create a whole new character, it took me awhile to figure out what i did wrong, at no point did i intercut between the doctors, i show them as distinct sections, i dont come back to 9 at the very end, supports her theory of he leaves her, she leaves him, bringing back 9 would have taken them back
-you can approach the vid for fans or for yourself and not care or not show it to your friends or show them the show beforehand...
-ex. Scream by laurashapiro and kass
-you do have the doctors that are brought in from the start, you have the different characters, the narrative is relying on the narration, the doctor takes all these women and gives them STDs or kills them, first it starts with glee then it resets itself with clara, i dont need to see it, i know where this is going, the intercutting and motion is so good you dont feel its different characters
-[kass] we wanted clara to appear in beginning because when we first meet her we dont know, it was something agonizing for us, we didnt know where clara's storyline was going
-its still interesting before clara does look different, it does feel like a new character, some people who dont watch the show may feel its the same person
-ex. Blank Space by such_heights and purple_fringe
-this is one case where there is so many faces, you wont understand it unless you understand the show
-doctor who has many challenges but please make more doctor who vids because i love them
Vidding as Media Literacy
Mod:
lola,
futuransky and
cathexys
-i think of vidding as media literacy on multiple levels, vidding is a place where people teach each other media criticism, also knowledge, tools and authorship, we share knowledge of how to rework media thats in our culture, why would it matter to be able to download vs. stream, many of my students dont know that stuff the way we vidders know that stuff, those are all elements of media literacy
-so we're talking about vids that are used as teaching and scholarship but also how vids are used as criticism within our communities, also want to hear experiences from other vidders
-we're all academics, we choose vidders work that we are inspired by...
-big questions that the panel may or may not answer:
-what is vidding in particular that we talk about here?
-what do vids offer culture? (media literacy, fan love, critique)
-potential problems of teaching vids and vidding
-do we lose something when this conversation moves beyond fandom?
-what happens when the same vids get used over and over again to represent vidding? should we be worried?
-how central is fannish love?
-are we developing a canon of vids that people get to see again and again? Us is a good example, i have a personal canon that doesnt always overlap with the vids i show in class
-when these vids are used in these intellectual context...
academic/vidder pairing: cathexys/sweetestdrain/sisabet
-i may know the vidder, i see what they talked about, theres such discussion, not necessary a vid others would show, i showed on the prowl, i taught in gender studies, vids are useful because theyre 3-4 minutes versus reading a story or watching 50 minutes of something you dont know, multifannish vids are usually successful but on the prowl is not, this is me, this is me, ahhh no longer me, to teach this, i used this once before, talking about context, i set up the framework and people did not respond, men didnt get it, i taught it 3 times, once in a fannish class, the first conversation of this kind of stuff, we talked about articles and hurt/comfort, the second time they saw it, they got so much more out of it, what we do in media, this was for self-portrait, this was someone making this as a self-portrait and they got it the third time, youre done now they understand this
-i used kiki_miserychic's princess vid (***Flawless) as an assignment, a lot of people wrote about it and were happy i put it on the syllabus, they had cultural knowledge, i dont think i could put on the prowl on the exam, you need to walk them through, we watch it just like we rewatch it, to layer it again and again, they dont know that im using a vid and doing this cool stuff with it
-sisabet: to bring it back to the self-portrait, it got overwhelming very fast, you always collaborate in case that happens, im done you take it, it went on someone elses YT channel, also the artist saw it and got mad at it, they got really good feedback, the editings great, thank you, we got a lot more reviews, they took off our name
-thats weird, even on livejournal, the fact that it was a self-portrait got lost, people didnt frame it as a self-portrait, they thought it was criticizing fandom, it does take that view, this is something that we do, why do we do this, is this okay, this is really hot, like wesley, yes it has to go up to 10
-the assumptions that we make when we teach vids, we know vividcon, we vid, but what would other people who want to engage with these vids but if they dont know how it works...
-if they dont understand hurt/comfort than the vid doesnt make sense
-we got interesting feedback such as this is the first time i found someone who understands, "it changed my life", we didnt expect that from it
-that question of context and how we frame, does it matter
-at this point it doesnt matter, we can say its a self-portrait but it doesnt matter, it matters what the viewer gets out of it
-thats true but do you want to be that teacher who 15 years later thinks, omg i saw this vid and didnt get it
-how much is it valuable to interface with the classroom
academic/vidder pairing: Lola/kiki_miserychic
-Lola: my students make remixes, i dont force them, they get inspired and do it, they do machinima and sports, they discover through vids, especially guys, inspired by aesthetics of vids with superheroes, a lot of dubstep fanvids, dubstep festivid scenes, these aesthetics are speaking to my students, i showed flawless
-cathexys: i asked my students, 7 page questionnaire, what fandoms they knew, the only one they all knew was disney, there was always 2-3 students who didnt know big fandoms, disney was the one thing we relied on
-winter class, 3.5 weeks, we watched ***Flawless four times, first time we watched it, i got the less good quality file and they kind of watched it, i showed it to them again in high quality and they were like OH, quality makes a big difference, resonated to the disney side of things and beyonce, it made a big difference when they got to talk to kiki_miserychic, see where she was coming from, they related to her as a creator, it humanized the process for them, it impacted how they...
-kiki_miserychic: when they talked about it, it was mostly in person, well what did you mean, but i kind of think when you watch it, what you bring is what you bring, i like all these things, this is what i like, i feel bad for liking them but why i should feel bad about it, its problematic to like it, am i supposed to like or feel bad, even after i give the explanation, its how it affects them, is it criticizing or are you celebrating it, but in the end what is it
-but you have to come up with a decision at the end
-ambivalence is an okay position to go at in creating
-we teach them to write essays where they have to write arguments arguing one position
-they emailed me they have to write the paper and they want me to tell them what the answer is, they might get it wrong...
academic/vidder pairing: Alexis/giandujakiss: Different Kind of Love Song
-i have not showed GK's vid in my class but i have written about vidding a lot, i made my first vid in 2008 because i took some classes on learning about digital humanities, pushed me into things i didnt want to do, i was already interested in it, i went to 24/7 conferences, i first saw superstar, it changed the way I think and write, it made me want to write about vids, it was a way of creating knowledge, its also incorporating bodies in another dimension, i do queer studies, i go into an academic field to find out who i was, not just because i have thoughts on complex things, ive written about vids, not superstar but maybe someday, last time i went to club vivid and its my favorite thing thats ever happened, a different kind of love song premiered, as i was dancing to it, the commentary that was happening was here, the relationships with gender...
-it wasnt until a year ago that i got a chance to write about it, i wrote to you, i didnt ask for permission (its public), looking for female fans and how hard it was, she does so much with gender and origin stories with race, i wanted to hear you talk back
-i wanted to do a celebratory depiction of fans, opening tag was marketing to us and control our dollars and then control what we do with it, fans rebelling in the freakiness, the fans especially the women, male fans are sympathetic and creators, the fangirls are weird like becky in supernatural, that was not this vid, isnt that awesome, youre the strange ones for looking at us and saying whats going with you, 3rd rock in the context of vid, lithgrow was right, the one thinking us strange are in the wrong, it actually changed from club vivid to go online, hard to find women, just after i submitted it, the charlie episode of supernatural aired, i changed it to add charlie
-i used both versions of the vid, show how the change adds tensions, whether to market to female fans
-we wanted to ask, think about your own or another persons vid that would have something to offer to a teaching class, sometimes i teach 8-11 year olds vids to help learn, to canonize or what not to canonize
-think about what vids could use in vids
-how much is that geisha in the window by lierduoma: the appearance of diversity versus actual diversity, women's work was gender studies, i put you there is why we do that thing
-how much is that geisha in the window: oh you can do THAT
-i was teaching supernatural, showed women's work by luminosity and sisabet, they couldnt understand why anyone would watch the show
-how much is that geisha, great if you havent seen firefly if they dont know source, women's work you dont understand if you havent seen supernatural and how its about two white guys
-Fireflies by talitha78, Infomercial vid [Please Please Please Let Me Get What I Want by Joyo and AbsoluteDestiny] because its strange
-Data's Dream by morgandawn: the joy of movement, the love of the source, bironic's Starships, her version and show them those two to show them why we love that sci-fi stuff
-data's dream enthralls a bunch of 17 year olds
-i showed anything for love by cesperanza and astolat, they didnt get any of it, they didnt get the source text, they knew magic mike but not anything else, they got the fannish love, trying to get your friend into it, its about the motivation and love
-i could just kill a man by counteragent, meta about fandom itself, seeing ourselves/others seeing us, still alive by counteragent supernatural meta
-ive taught still alive, tried to conceptualize for people but its hard for people to get
-[thuviaptarth:] i want to challenge all this, when you ask that question i think of origin stories that i commissioned, i made hey ho about the military industry context, those obviously come up, theyre very clear, political, theyre very respectable, theyre part of academic canon of vidding that we use to justify exemptions for OTW, its very important to me, its the margins for me rather than the center, the majority of vids are not necessary celebrations, theyre about the emotional connections to source, laurashapiro said telling deeper, very source specific, hard to translate because its about talking about a certain source, discussing things at large, inherently without fannish context, interaction of fannish knowledge with this particular work of art, very respectable, get into academia without having to have that fandom knowledge to this, when henry jenkins asked for fandoms to try, he tried heroes and supernatural, he did post about heroes and then later did one about supernatural, can go to heroes to typical universe superhero shows versus supernatural were in it for slash fandom or intense emotional bond, in it for emotional catharsis that is not respectable that is not academic, it took pushing to say, its deliberatively divorced from that
-that is the cost of what we lose, i show women's work and then they dont want to see supernatural slash vids
-we talked about canonized, we use OTW test suite and those are crystal clear arguments, i dont care if theres a canon, i care that its effective, ive read academics that say harry potter is no longer a fandom that the kids know, vids that you dont have the fannish knowledge, superstar if you dont know faith/buffy switched bodies idk
-we make them read or watch the movie when we read, when i accidentally taught my dad how it works, the good, the bad and the ugly and it involved a lot of breathplay
-im teaching vidding but im not sure what im going to pick, most successful when im not teaching vidding, its intro to lit, everyone has to take and doesnt care, we watched never let me go and then played vid, its subtle, this is going along with the text, frat boys went ?!, they knew this text easily
-can you really care about something if you dont care about the source text, i taught math/science course to kids who knew nothing about sci-fi stories, not one of them had seen the matrix, no one cared about sci-fi, i worked my way through class that no one liked but me, do i want to teach an entire course around disney
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Life After Vidding
Mod: vagabondage and
pipsqueaky
-youre vidding and you had a great time vidding and then you stop and cant vid
-its okay to have your vidding mojo wear out
-split into three parts, the therapy part, it gets very depressing, very frustrating, its a terrible hobby, my mojo dried up for 6 years and all of a sudden i started vidding again
-my mojo has not returned yet, its been four years now, im being okay with this, will my vidder friends still hang out with me, i come to vividcon and enjoy talking about it, ive reached a zen place
-i feel if im not vidding, i cant participate, if i dont have my vidding mojo i have nothing
-i know people when they are vidding, cant watch vids, other people when theyre vidding will watch other vids to steal ideas or be inspired
-when you cant vid, one of the best ways to vid is pick a song, pick an episode of a tv, just start grabbing clips, oh i love that scene, its so pretty and throw it on the timeline, your brain gets past the point of i cant vid, youre vidding even if its a piece of crap
-i have more vidding mojo after i finish vids, i get all excited, your creative juices are flowing
-anything that hasnt worked? i tried to slow the earths rotation
-have stopped because i didnt have time, also emotional, not enough room left for vidding
-i was trying to make a vid, it was just work, one more thing i had to force myself to do, instead of forgetting to pee, i used it to take breaks
-if its not fun then why am i doing it, theres different kinds of fun, when im exhausted and im short on time, the kind of fun i want is pringles fun, im going to fuck around on tumblr because theres no effort, with vidding i have to sit down and do stuff to make stuff happen, pringles as opposed to make a good meal for myself that i have to spend half hour in kitchen for
-the longer i go without releasing vids, i feel like im falling behind everybody else, community is going this way and im standing all the way back there
-i came off a two year hiatus, if im going to make something i have to continue my learning trajectory...
-being able to ditch that concept was how i was able to get back into vids, i had four year hiatus actually and the first vid i made after it wasnt ambitious, it wasnt a statement, you can just make a vid to something you like, after that i made 7 festivids [absolutedestiny]
-if you can get that vid out, every vid does not have to be a masterpiece, if you can puke one out the rest will follow
-give yourself permission to make vids for yourself that no one else needs to see
-have someone come over and vid together either in person or online, get a personal cheerleader, just put that song in the timeline and throw some clips on timeline, then think of making something serious
-we are our own worse critics, when i come back it needs to be big and bold and friends will say no, just put some clips on the timeline
-after you make that first vid, you dont like the vid, any advice?
-...exposure exercise, heres what im afraid of, what is the irrational voice saying and then do it anyways, take small steps and do it anyway even though the voice says youre stupid, tell it to fuck off
-i was afraid to learn a new way to vid, i used to do old fashioned capture, still when im making a vid i will have to talk to 2-3 different people, someone talk me through it, get a buddy, get a vid buddy
-the other thing to do, if you try all this and it doesnt work, its OKAY, you dont have to vid, i dont have any vids this year for the first time and im okay with it, im really happy with other aspects of my life, im finally doing what i wanted to do all my life, i have other goals, my creative energy is going to those, ive been putting pressure on myself to do it and it feels like a chore, if you dont have a vid in premieres youre not a real vidder: thats not true
-the thing that overrides should be...new fandom or revisiting an old idea, not i need to make these 5 year old fandoms, find something new and shiny, its my way of being in this community...
-everytime ive had a gap or break, ive broken the hiatus by making a movie vid
-when you feel like you want to vid but the ideas arent there, on whatever social media youre on, tell your friends to toss you vid ideas or what fandoms and what songs they like and put them together and see what comes
-just look at festivids requests, dont sign up, just make a treat
-if you have a hiatus and then you get into a hot new fandom, it can be stressful, when you first vid, it might take you awhile to make that vid, omg theyve already vidded this thing
-i love this fandom, everyone else is making the same vids, why should i bother?, make it,
-it can be new to you, everyone who still loves the fandom, everyone will fall over themselves
-the people who loved the fandom back then are starving for vids...
-does anyone really need this, i had a bucky/steve idea, do we really need another one, are vids a thing that people need, existential
-yes there needs to be another vid for x/x because you like it...remember its fun
-i never get tired about watching a million vids to my favorite characters...
-my one time i vid is for vividcon and this is an intimidating place, i come out saying, i want to vid, later and its a vicious cycle
-the concom hates it, not every vid in vividcon has to be amazing because we've had a couple good years, no make your vid, put it into premieres, its good enough, someone out there will love it, every vid has an audience out there somewhere
-someone loves the luke/hermione vid unironically
-im going to stand up for that vid because it provides years of happiness
-its not like other people are saying it has to be great for vividcon, im doing it myself
-youre being too nice, a con is an opportunity to show a vid to an audience who cant get away from it
-im going to MAKE you guys watch it
-i dont feel like vidding anything but watch this small fandom that no one will watch online but you have to watch it
-maybe if we werent so harsh at vid review, people wouldnt feel that way about Premieres, after vid review some people feel like suicide, if you cant handle negativity, dont go to vid review
-vid review is not for vidder, its for the audience, death of the author
-bringing vids to a con is a brave thing to do, this con is not your audience, they may not care, they may have issues with your vid, its hugely brave
-we tend to conflate vidding and vividcon in our community, our cycles are around vividcon and festivids with deadlines, i cant put my vid out there and what if i put it out there and no one likes it, you can make a vid for yourself, for a friend, outside of them
-i want to make a vid but im too afraid, thats what challenge is for, you can be anonymous
-ive not made a vid thats not for festivids or vividcon
-sometimes signing up and committing vids to festivids or vvc can help get you to do it...
-i still think of you as a vidder because youve made vids i love, but for myself i think im not a vidder, i cant claim it
-if youve made a vid, youre a vidder, if you dont make vids, youre still important, if youre telling us how much you love the vid...
-for festivids treats, if it existed one person would be incredibly happy and it was liberating...
-so many people will pee their pants with joy if you make that vid for festivids fandom, it doesnt have to be a masterpiece
-some of my most satisfying vids were my first three years in festivids...
-i love concrit, i love to hear what people say
-not signing up for festivids, i signed up for back to the future to tik tok and its the only vid i still like
-i have trouble finding songs that anyone other than me will like, list of songs for club vivid that people want, having that list helped make it possible for me to vid
-trouble finding song: ask people, try IRC vidding chatroom, its really easy, plenty of clients to download, great place to ask for songs, im thinking of making this vid, anyone need help
-spotify: search for pre-curated playlists, also related artists of songs
-cdbaby is a great place, small artists, half the time theyre happy that someone knows about them
-i made this club vivid vid to prince and it was super fast shut down
-artists may link vids on twitter with smaller fanbases to expose to wider audience
-some people will post your vid and take your name off of it
-when i have a vid when i want to use lyrics, i will literally google for lyrics like "i will be there for you"
-more than anything, finding support is important, find someone in here and look for support, email, both of you can come up with clip to throw on the timeline
-i think with adobe creative cloud will keep things in the cloud so multiple people can access
-lay a bunch of clips on the timeline with no music, the song can come after, sometimes the music comes first and sometimes lyrics with composing music, you can even switch songs and modify your vid
-a lot of my vids have come from using a song i knew wasnt right and working with the clips helps me figure out what the right song is
-because the majority of what we work for is 4/4 time, its probably going to fit
-make your own mashups until you find something that works
-you dont have to feel like you dont contribute to fandom because you can no longer produce, people leave fandom because they dont create, its not about what we make, its about what we love
-it helped when i was not a vidder for years, please dont insult all the people like me that when youre not vidding, youre not part of the community...you can be one of us for awhile
-ive used up all my ideas, i cant learn new vid tech, then hear song and ask for help guys, teach me how to vid, even if you cant afford new tech there are plenty of ways to help you get free tech and source, people will help you find them
-its doesnt matter what the conclusion of your vidding dry spell is...i havent vidded at all since 2011, im not planning on vidding again but im still going to come to vividcon, im still part of the community
-it makes me crazy that people will abandon something they love because they feel theyre not doing enough, we're all here for each other, yeah we can help each other make the vids but you dont have to..., dont be resentful about fandom
-one of my big motivators, read previous comments on older vids, if im doubting myself, i read the comments and people like my vids, am i insulting commenters because i think my vid is crap
-i like reading comments because it tells me i can do things, if it turns ok...you just have to wait for the person who sees your vid and thinks your vid is amazing
-since we've all made these vids, leave comments on people's vids, it can just be a smile, you dont have to do deep analysis
-i love the ways you arrange the clips to the music...i love them, thank you i had a lot of fun doing that
-we're all part of the community, we all love and support each other, if you see someone struggling help them out, if you dont have any ideas, hook them up with a friend who loves music and can give song suggestions, if you come out of here and its helped you unblock, great and if you come out of here still blocked, thats fabulous
Stop, Collaborate and Listen
Mod: jarrow
-the idea is for this to be different from past panels, much of the time 2/3 of it will be activity based, untested experiment, lets talk about what collaboration is
-collaboration is two or more people together working on a vid, doesnt have to be in the same location, doesnt mean you're my beta, making clip choices together, one person can drive (do the actual vid work) and other is not, that works out fine except when it doesnt
-what are some things that worked well in collaboration
-it helps me to get unstuck, pass it back and forth, your turn, tag you're it
-collaboration for multifandom vid, helpful to split up the research
-you will always find the other person will know things that you do not know
-when playing out the structure, helps the planning process, helps to solidify the ideas, helps to have someone to talk it out with
-as a fellow extrovert it helps me to talk about it
-instant beta feedback to tell when something is not working, dont need to keep emailing back and forth, theyre right there with you
-its fun!!! we made this together, its our baby, it can look like both of us but it looks more like you
-they do the hard tech parts (usually absolutedestiny)
-laurashapiro was able to do the credits and jarrow could help out with tech
-when youre in the flow and you need a clip and you can have someone else find the clip for you so you dont have to fall out of the good part of vidding, you dont lose your vidding mojo
-go get constipated angel and then partner can get it
-different skill sets allows vid to have more expertise going into it versus just one person, different styles can go into it, there can be more variety, different knowledge, different skills
-anything to do with a friend, brought me closer to friend
-what are the things that have not worked, certain challenges that come along with a collaboration
-you have to speak up for yourself and not let yourself get dominated, especially if its a friend and you dont want to hurt their precious feelings
-conflicting vision for the vid
-being able to say, that clip you put in, does not work, kill your darling, im fine with everything but this one clip and maybe thats their favorite clip
-there has to be compromise, you can take out one clip and ill take out one of your clips
-coordinating between tech, my computer doesnt even get along with its own tech
-it can be hard to communicate, we did one together, i was running the tech and she kept saying, move the clip over two frames, i have no idea what your problem with this is, especially if you use two different tech systems or youre tired
-if we know how to put things into words, we wouldn't be vidders
-im telling you exactly how to fix it and youre not understanding, i know this is not right but i dont know what it should be, i know its not quite that, i dont know the fix
-started the collaboration and realize our styles dont match well, we'd be better friends, incompatibility
-if you have two people used to being project leaders, two alphas, it can be tough
-when your collaboration partner isnt pulling their weight, you want to work on the vid, theyre not communicative, theyre not around, youre doing all the work of the collaboration, havent heard from them in 3 weeks
-my J for Myers-Briggs, i havent heard from you...
-you are super pressuring me right now, i am having a life and ill get to it later
-two vidders enter, one vid leaves (no death), we are going to be talking to each other, you dont have to speak if you have social anxiety, we want to expand the idea of collaboration to these other things, help me find a song, be my beta, help with tech, theres a vid where theres something we need that we dont have
-if youre not at vividcon, how do you seek help, is there a secret place
-theres a convention called wiscon that puts together an older vidder and younger vidder, sometimes it works and sometimes it doesnt, if you email them they can help
-ask your friends, talk to here's luck or way2busymom, they have lots of songs, gave fan_eunice many songs even if its not a collaboration
-theres a large population of people who are frightened of software but have vid ideas, if you can drive, lets make your vid, tell me your ideas and i can make it, can help find people who arent in the vidding community
-even if you dont find your perfect match, there will be vids that get made because of the next twenty minutes
-checklist of things you might need: song, tech, partner, help developing a concept, beta, cheerleading, source
-you dont always know what youre going to do in terms of agreeing to beta, help collaborate because it can depend on an idea, dont want to be awkward to say no to somebody
Vidding Doctor Who
Mod:
milly
-challenge to vid because so much source, same character but many different actors, a lot of challenges with doing it because a lot of people will connect differently to a story, not everyone is familiar with all the source, new who fans didnt watch classic who, doctor who is spread out 50 years with black and white to very sparkly stuff, vidding wise its fun to play with
-ex. Not Done With My Changes by kass
[was out of room]
ex. Take On Me by trelkez
-one thing with this vid is it has a very specific structure, it starts out with old school, heres the doctor, then follows 9, 10 and 11 chronologically, only times doctor comes back is later on in vid to give history especially during regeneration, it makes it look more epic, it avoids the constant changing of source quality, helps the eye not jump from one to the other, some people dont have issues but i do with quality, it might depend on when you started watching, interesting way to present the doctor without going around the obstacle, also great cvv vid
-another way to vid the doctor is each number is his own person, blurry on the show whether doctor is different, your music choice and narrative is going to be affected, not as much as 9 and 10 but 11 has their own visual quality, there are some people who have never seen doctor who and dont understand so it helps to just have a vid about one doctor but you lose out on the rich history
ex. Love is Cool by such_heights and purple_fringe
-team 11 vid, this vid is only 11, amy and rory arent with other doctors but river had interactions with 10 which was not referred to at all, its completely distinct from 10, its how fandom usually looks at him, doctor who is one of the fandoms where you go, thats my doctor, in vidding you have vids that present them as very distinct, vids are focused on one aspect of the doctor that still refer to past
-ex. Ghost by morgandawn
-in this one, morgandawn used promotional footage when doctor who was coming back, it was just narration of 9 running down this corridor, the whole theme of the vid of ghost but it also has this layer of all the people he's left behind, it gives us the richness of the character, i dont know if it was done today with the special of the time wars, would you consider promotional source external? not really, its like using a deleted scene, it doesnt contradict anything, it can be used as a metaphor, running away from past with explosions, here's 11 with all the companions and you can also just focus on just one character
-...do i just use 9 and Rose or 10 and Rose or both, doctor who broke my dry spell, i have a friend who didnt watch doctor who but didnt know what my vid meant after, i didnt handle that well, she didnt get that the character was the same person
-ex. Be Yourself by milly
-my friend (hadnt seen doctor who) watched this vid, thats kind of sad, thats interesting, whats sad...after i explained regeneration, i dont think i would have guessed that from vid, theres always going to be a barrier, people will miss some subtleties, but they probably wont create a whole new character, it took me awhile to figure out what i did wrong, at no point did i intercut between the doctors, i show them as distinct sections, i dont come back to 9 at the very end, supports her theory of he leaves her, she leaves him, bringing back 9 would have taken them back
-you can approach the vid for fans or for yourself and not care or not show it to your friends or show them the show beforehand...
-ex. Scream by laurashapiro and kass
-you do have the doctors that are brought in from the start, you have the different characters, the narrative is relying on the narration, the doctor takes all these women and gives them STDs or kills them, first it starts with glee then it resets itself with clara, i dont need to see it, i know where this is going, the intercutting and motion is so good you dont feel its different characters
-[kass] we wanted clara to appear in beginning because when we first meet her we dont know, it was something agonizing for us, we didnt know where clara's storyline was going
-its still interesting before clara does look different, it does feel like a new character, some people who dont watch the show may feel its the same person
-ex. Blank Space by such_heights and purple_fringe
-this is one case where there is so many faces, you wont understand it unless you understand the show
-doctor who has many challenges but please make more doctor who vids because i love them
Vidding as Media Literacy
Mod:
lola,
futuransky and
cathexys
-i think of vidding as media literacy on multiple levels, vidding is a place where people teach each other media criticism, also knowledge, tools and authorship, we share knowledge of how to rework media thats in our culture, why would it matter to be able to download vs. stream, many of my students dont know that stuff the way we vidders know that stuff, those are all elements of media literacy
-so we're talking about vids that are used as teaching and scholarship but also how vids are used as criticism within our communities, also want to hear experiences from other vidders
-we're all academics, we choose vidders work that we are inspired by...
-big questions that the panel may or may not answer:
-what is vidding in particular that we talk about here?
-what do vids offer culture? (media literacy, fan love, critique)
-potential problems of teaching vids and vidding
-do we lose something when this conversation moves beyond fandom?
-what happens when the same vids get used over and over again to represent vidding? should we be worried?
-how central is fannish love?
-are we developing a canon of vids that people get to see again and again? Us is a good example, i have a personal canon that doesnt always overlap with the vids i show in class
-when these vids are used in these intellectual context...
academic/vidder pairing: cathexys/sweetestdrain/sisabet
-i may know the vidder, i see what they talked about, theres such discussion, not necessary a vid others would show, i showed on the prowl, i taught in gender studies, vids are useful because theyre 3-4 minutes versus reading a story or watching 50 minutes of something you dont know, multifannish vids are usually successful but on the prowl is not, this is me, this is me, ahhh no longer me, to teach this, i used this once before, talking about context, i set up the framework and people did not respond, men didnt get it, i taught it 3 times, once in a fannish class, the first conversation of this kind of stuff, we talked about articles and hurt/comfort, the second time they saw it, they got so much more out of it, what we do in media, this was for self-portrait, this was someone making this as a self-portrait and they got it the third time, youre done now they understand this
-i used kiki_miserychic's princess vid (***Flawless) as an assignment, a lot of people wrote about it and were happy i put it on the syllabus, they had cultural knowledge, i dont think i could put on the prowl on the exam, you need to walk them through, we watch it just like we rewatch it, to layer it again and again, they dont know that im using a vid and doing this cool stuff with it
-sisabet: to bring it back to the self-portrait, it got overwhelming very fast, you always collaborate in case that happens, im done you take it, it went on someone elses YT channel, also the artist saw it and got mad at it, they got really good feedback, the editings great, thank you, we got a lot more reviews, they took off our name
-thats weird, even on livejournal, the fact that it was a self-portrait got lost, people didnt frame it as a self-portrait, they thought it was criticizing fandom, it does take that view, this is something that we do, why do we do this, is this okay, this is really hot, like wesley, yes it has to go up to 10
-the assumptions that we make when we teach vids, we know vividcon, we vid, but what would other people who want to engage with these vids but if they dont know how it works...
-if they dont understand hurt/comfort than the vid doesnt make sense
-we got interesting feedback such as this is the first time i found someone who understands, "it changed my life", we didnt expect that from it
-that question of context and how we frame, does it matter
-at this point it doesnt matter, we can say its a self-portrait but it doesnt matter, it matters what the viewer gets out of it
-thats true but do you want to be that teacher who 15 years later thinks, omg i saw this vid and didnt get it
-how much is it valuable to interface with the classroom
academic/vidder pairing: Lola/kiki_miserychic
-Lola: my students make remixes, i dont force them, they get inspired and do it, they do machinima and sports, they discover through vids, especially guys, inspired by aesthetics of vids with superheroes, a lot of dubstep fanvids, dubstep festivid scenes, these aesthetics are speaking to my students, i showed flawless
-cathexys: i asked my students, 7 page questionnaire, what fandoms they knew, the only one they all knew was disney, there was always 2-3 students who didnt know big fandoms, disney was the one thing we relied on
-winter class, 3.5 weeks, we watched ***Flawless four times, first time we watched it, i got the less good quality file and they kind of watched it, i showed it to them again in high quality and they were like OH, quality makes a big difference, resonated to the disney side of things and beyonce, it made a big difference when they got to talk to kiki_miserychic, see where she was coming from, they related to her as a creator, it humanized the process for them, it impacted how they...
-kiki_miserychic: when they talked about it, it was mostly in person, well what did you mean, but i kind of think when you watch it, what you bring is what you bring, i like all these things, this is what i like, i feel bad for liking them but why i should feel bad about it, its problematic to like it, am i supposed to like or feel bad, even after i give the explanation, its how it affects them, is it criticizing or are you celebrating it, but in the end what is it
-but you have to come up with a decision at the end
-ambivalence is an okay position to go at in creating
-we teach them to write essays where they have to write arguments arguing one position
-they emailed me they have to write the paper and they want me to tell them what the answer is, they might get it wrong...
academic/vidder pairing: Alexis/giandujakiss: Different Kind of Love Song
-i have not showed GK's vid in my class but i have written about vidding a lot, i made my first vid in 2008 because i took some classes on learning about digital humanities, pushed me into things i didnt want to do, i was already interested in it, i went to 24/7 conferences, i first saw superstar, it changed the way I think and write, it made me want to write about vids, it was a way of creating knowledge, its also incorporating bodies in another dimension, i do queer studies, i go into an academic field to find out who i was, not just because i have thoughts on complex things, ive written about vids, not superstar but maybe someday, last time i went to club vivid and its my favorite thing thats ever happened, a different kind of love song premiered, as i was dancing to it, the commentary that was happening was here, the relationships with gender...
-it wasnt until a year ago that i got a chance to write about it, i wrote to you, i didnt ask for permission (its public), looking for female fans and how hard it was, she does so much with gender and origin stories with race, i wanted to hear you talk back
-i wanted to do a celebratory depiction of fans, opening tag was marketing to us and control our dollars and then control what we do with it, fans rebelling in the freakiness, the fans especially the women, male fans are sympathetic and creators, the fangirls are weird like becky in supernatural, that was not this vid, isnt that awesome, youre the strange ones for looking at us and saying whats going with you, 3rd rock in the context of vid, lithgrow was right, the one thinking us strange are in the wrong, it actually changed from club vivid to go online, hard to find women, just after i submitted it, the charlie episode of supernatural aired, i changed it to add charlie
-i used both versions of the vid, show how the change adds tensions, whether to market to female fans
-we wanted to ask, think about your own or another persons vid that would have something to offer to a teaching class, sometimes i teach 8-11 year olds vids to help learn, to canonize or what not to canonize
-think about what vids could use in vids
-how much is that geisha in the window by lierduoma: the appearance of diversity versus actual diversity, women's work was gender studies, i put you there is why we do that thing
-how much is that geisha in the window: oh you can do THAT
-i was teaching supernatural, showed women's work by luminosity and sisabet, they couldnt understand why anyone would watch the show
-how much is that geisha, great if you havent seen firefly if they dont know source, women's work you dont understand if you havent seen supernatural and how its about two white guys
-Fireflies by talitha78, Infomercial vid [Please Please Please Let Me Get What I Want by Joyo and AbsoluteDestiny] because its strange
-Data's Dream by morgandawn: the joy of movement, the love of the source, bironic's Starships, her version and show them those two to show them why we love that sci-fi stuff
-data's dream enthralls a bunch of 17 year olds
-i showed anything for love by cesperanza and astolat, they didnt get any of it, they didnt get the source text, they knew magic mike but not anything else, they got the fannish love, trying to get your friend into it, its about the motivation and love
-i could just kill a man by counteragent, meta about fandom itself, seeing ourselves/others seeing us, still alive by counteragent supernatural meta
-ive taught still alive, tried to conceptualize for people but its hard for people to get
-[thuviaptarth:] i want to challenge all this, when you ask that question i think of origin stories that i commissioned, i made hey ho about the military industry context, those obviously come up, theyre very clear, political, theyre very respectable, theyre part of academic canon of vidding that we use to justify exemptions for OTW, its very important to me, its the margins for me rather than the center, the majority of vids are not necessary celebrations, theyre about the emotional connections to source, laurashapiro said telling deeper, very source specific, hard to translate because its about talking about a certain source, discussing things at large, inherently without fannish context, interaction of fannish knowledge with this particular work of art, very respectable, get into academia without having to have that fandom knowledge to this, when henry jenkins asked for fandoms to try, he tried heroes and supernatural, he did post about heroes and then later did one about supernatural, can go to heroes to typical universe superhero shows versus supernatural were in it for slash fandom or intense emotional bond, in it for emotional catharsis that is not respectable that is not academic, it took pushing to say, its deliberatively divorced from that
-that is the cost of what we lose, i show women's work and then they dont want to see supernatural slash vids
-we talked about canonized, we use OTW test suite and those are crystal clear arguments, i dont care if theres a canon, i care that its effective, ive read academics that say harry potter is no longer a fandom that the kids know, vids that you dont have the fannish knowledge, superstar if you dont know faith/buffy switched bodies idk
-we make them read or watch the movie when we read, when i accidentally taught my dad how it works, the good, the bad and the ugly and it involved a lot of breathplay
-im teaching vidding but im not sure what im going to pick, most successful when im not teaching vidding, its intro to lit, everyone has to take and doesnt care, we watched never let me go and then played vid, its subtle, this is going along with the text, frat boys went ?!, they knew this text easily
-can you really care about something if you dont care about the source text, i taught math/science course to kids who knew nothing about sci-fi stories, not one of them had seen the matrix, no one cared about sci-fi, i worked my way through class that no one liked but me, do i want to teach an entire course around disney
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