The flaw in the diamond highlights the clarity of the character.
It appears I'm aimlessly drifting through the internet, again, looking perhaps for something of meaning or value in a day that was fine on all accounts but felt full of the feeling of disconnection
( Read more... )
That said, you can love someone who does things that are harmful to you - but I agree you can't be around that person or you have to limit some interactions. Which leads into the distance you are talking about. It's not necessary to stop loving someone who willfully or obliviously hurts you but it is necessary to protect yourself from being hurt.
My definition for unconditional love is refined as simply:
Genuine concern for the well being of another without concern for what you will get from it.
I.E. If I love you because you bake me delicious pies that's conditional. If you stop baking me pies and I get cranky at you about it I'm putting my needs above my concern for your well being. That's conditional.
Frankly when I started to view the world through this lens it made it crystal clear where a problem originated. This I found to be dramatically important because that problem often originated in my thinking and that's something I do have the power to correct.
In this post I am exploring the concept that loving people that have traits that we value is a form of self love, and rejecting people because they contain traits that we hate is a form of elitism.
Now I'm not making any particular judgment on that being wrong. Just that I will also know that I truly love someone if I do not treat them any different for having traits that I do not like (helping to affirm that my concern is for them, not what I get from them)
Reply
But I also come from the place of never knowing for sure whether someone else's love for me is real or a form of control/manipulation. It's an obstacle I am still working to overcome.
I've had people say up and down that they love me, but the moment I don't behave the way they want me to, I'm out. That's when I suspect that they don't really love me, just the role I'm supposed to play in their life.
While behavior alone shouldn't determine whether you love someone, behavior certainly proves whether or not someone else loves you for real.
Sometimes walking away is a sign of love. True fact.
Reply
Even past that goes the fact that in our society we put a lot of value *on* conditional interaction. I feel an American value is finding the mutual win (not necessarily the equal win).
Walking away is all in how it's done. Most people leave nosily and not peacefully or mindfully. Disengaging from conflict is often a best first step and can be done lovingly. If you ask someone to stop screaming at you and they can't (or won't), it's best to walk away quietly and without drama. That way is very hospitable to a return to positive interaction at a later point.
There's a lot of things we do as humans that communicate we don't love someone, none more than judgment. That's probably the most love devastating behavior. If I'm judging you all you can hear is me saying you're not good enough and that I don't love you. It's amazing how powerful that can be.
Reply
However, some folks intentionally engage the heightened emotion in order to scare the other person off from addressing the real problems, or anything else they consider negative. That's a behavior problem that yields no solution unless the reactive cycle is intentionally broken.
I think all of these issues have a positive and negative application. Even judgement isn't entirely negative as long as it is coupled with justice and love. But yes, often judgement is an absolute form of control and an assertion that there is only one right way to do things.
Personally, when I'm ready to walk away because I've been taking a lot of damage, I am willing to start a fight over the issue that matters to me most. If the other person loves me, they'll help me resolve that issue. If they don't love me, I establish my personal boundaries and take the opportunity to walk away.
The other person can always come find me again, but not until the issue that matters to me is resolved.
Part of love is being able to handle conflict in a healthy and productive way. Conflict and misunderstanding is a part of life. There is no way around it, only through.
Is that judgemental? maybe? All I know is that love doesn't require you to be a pussy and get walked all over for the rest of your life. There should be strength involved and the ability to overcome obstacles or that love will never survive the real world to begin with.
Reply
I don't think loving someone predicates specific behaviors, that's a slippery slope, because it's not fair to say someone will do a specific thing if they love you. They will be concerned but how that concern manifests itself in action will be determined on both the capability of that person but what they think will help the most.
The other person can always come find me again, but not until the issue that matters to me is resolved.
This is a very good sign that you almost certainly don't unconditionally love that person. To me it appears your condition is the resolution to your satisfaction of the issue you were willing to fight about. Which sounds a lot like 'My way or the highway.'
Now I want to point out that I'm not saying this to be combative, I rather enjoy this discussion, but this is what I see and if I didn't point it out I'd be doing both of us a disservice.
I tend to think the best way to approach conflict is that it's both parties responsibility to work to resolve it. Some people are more skilled than others and are going to carry an 'unfair' burden of that duty. Truly though if we put ourselves in a position of 'come fix this with me' we are being somewhat domineering. It's hard for people to approach that kind of position. Even if we think we're 'Available' to them to resolve the issue.
Reply
Then go read my journal from the last month for a case example.
In this case, if someone loves me, they WILL communicate with me and help resolve problems. I'm not asking them to go through a specific ritual, I'm only asking them to make it right in whatever capacity is possible.
If they love you, they will compromise to find a MUTUAL solution. RECIPROCATION.
Unconditional is not always HEALTHY. There must be balance. If a person doesn't care about you enough to resolve a problem, they don't care about you enough.
Straight up.
Reply
I'm not saying that makes it all right, I'm just saying it's explicable.
Some people just lack the ability to think past themselves. It's really sad, and yes frustrating and maddening at times.
The exact wrong way to expect things to get better is to believe they will manifest love from nothing inside of them.
When people hear us, see us, for who we are and accept us despite our terrible flaws a breeding ground for love is fostered.
We run, we hide, we attack, we lie, we do all sorts of things to protect ourself when we don't feel loved. It's not abnormal or wrong, it's just what happens.
So it's probably true that they don't love you - though they may wish they had enough inside to do so. If we make these sorts of judgments we're probably stopping ourselves from being able to truly love and accept those for who they clearly are, maybe for the same reasons even.
I'm just philosophizing here. I don't have the answers to any specific interaction which I think you have in mind as we're talking. I'll take a look and see if I can't give you some helpful feedback.
Reply
Unconditional love doesn't mean you spend your life taking it, it means you're willing to RESOLVE problems, because life will dish problems out regardless of whether love is involved.
I actually believe that my mom DOES love me, but not enough to overcome her fear. And as much as I love her back, sometimes it's not enough. Sometimes poor behavior is a more important sign than the expression of love.
Everyone deserves to be loved for REAL. Don't settle for less or you'll never get to real.
Reply
By the same axiom of not loving yourself, if you are concerned for being loved by another it puts a condition on your love.
I think I have to be detached from the idea of receiving reciprocal unconditional love.
If I only knew then what I know now.... heh.
That said, life's a journey, I may yet find that love inside myself to give to another partner. I'm not convinced it's possible or that I want to. It generally means I'd have to resolve some feelings I'd rather leave unresolved or as they are.
Such is life.
Reply
I had no intention of getting into another relationship any time soon. I only intended to be true to myself and my passion for life.
In finding my own passion, I also found the ability to share that passion with another person.
I love TJ unconditionally. Always will. But if he starts becoming a threat (which is a fairly absurd concept with him) to my well-being or that of our children, I guess my love becomes conditional.
This pure love you talk of is conceptual. It's a good way to be and to think about love. In real life, there are certain conditions that are NECESSARY in order to be truly happy and healthy.
And honestly, if the other person doesn't care about your overall health and happiness, then it's probably not love to begin with. But sometimes you only know that based on their behavior.
Be true to yourself and stay open to the person who likes you FOR YOU and is willing to SHARE a life with you. It exists. The only way you won't find it is if you settle for a "lesser" unconditional love. ;)
Reply
By the former we will make more unconditional bonds than the latter which will almost assuredly lead us to conditional exchanges (which will probably end in judgmental conflicts).
Reply
Love is not unconditionally accepting that you will be treated like a second class citizen for the rest of your life. That's simply not love, and I won't accept it from anyone, no matter how much I unconditionally love them.
I will never stop loving my family, but that does not mean I am incapable of walking away from their damage.
Reply
I've had a differently screwed up family :P
I dealt with it differently, too. I eventually recognized that I didn't truly love my parents or siblings the way real love works. That I was engaging in conditional love.
As much as I didn't want to see it; it was clear as day when I began to investigate it. It felt awful, more awful than anything to think those thoughts about myself.
I reject so many of their flaws, so constantly, that it was clear that I didn't just love them. Granted that's true of the inverse, when you're beaten as a child you learn rather quickly to hide yourself emotionally and protect what little you have inside of you.
So while I say 'I love you' to them because it's a loving thing to do - I know it's false, truly, and I feel alone and empty some days. I wish I did love them better, wish I had enough compassion and concern to truly love them but I have suffered a lot of bull-shit because of them.
That isn't to say things aren't much better than they were when I was young. They certainly are.
It's just now I'm under no disillusions that my 'love' for them is unconditional or pure.
I've only even loved one person unconditionally (romantically) but it didn't start that way because I had no reference point to what that looked like because no one had ever loved me unconditionally. That experience changed my entire life and the way I look at everything.
I do, thankfully have a number of friends I do truly love without judgment. It was much easier to see this once I become more objective on the topic.
When you really care about someone like that it's the greatest gift you've ever given. I count myself lucky, many people never get to see that inside themselves and I would have been resigned to a life of lies and false loves if I refused to see and accept it.
I may love my children but it's not their job to love me. We learned from our parents conditional love to the nth degree. If we did well they praised us, if we did poorly they scolded us. Our value was always relative. They too learned that from their parents. It's not really anyone's fault - but once you start to understand it if you don't take personal steps to change it; it becomes your responsibility that it's this way.
Reply
To get to the good stuff, you HAVE to leave the bad stuff behind. Unconditional love is special and cannot be found just because you want it to be there.
Reciprocation, again. If the love doesn't flow both ways, it's not really there. You can't build a life on fake love. It will collapse around you.
Reply
I don't think real love involves any sort of reciprocation, though. I think that's a nice idea and it wouldn't suck and all - but it builds in a conditional component if it becomes a requirement for your love.
Because really what's the value of my love if it's not freely given?
Meh, then we're all just emotional whores.
When I say 'I love you' I want it to mean that, not 'I'll care for you so long as I get what I want in return'. Ya know?
Reply
Hurt is part of love. Hurt is not a villain to be run away from, but it must be dealt with and healed. If healing is impossible, it's not very desirable to stay in ANY sort of relationship that requires you to bleed from a constantly open wound.
I wish love were simple, but it's not. I wish my father loved my mom for REAL, and regardless of the words that come out of his mouth, he doesn't. He's spent TWENTY-FIVE years demanding unconditional love from the whole family without ever reciprocating.
That's called codependent and dysfunctional. And yet my mom stays because of "unconditional love."
It's a beautiful sort of love, but very very very dangerous when abused. It only works when unconditional love goes BOTH WAYS.
Reply
Leave a comment