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philmophlegm December 14 2012, 11:23:03 UTC
The audiophile claims / myths post is interesting, but it's a shame that so many of the tests start with a typical audiophile view of what a basic, entry-level product is. Apart from the tiny, tiny population of very rich audiophiles, I would have thought that most people would see a Pioneer amp as actually quite a high-end piece of kit, not one to be the cheapest in a survey. What would have made this a more interesting collection of articles is more tests where the cheapest alternative was something genuinely cheap, for example does that "cheap" Pioneer amp sound any better than a £50 'home cinema 5.1 speaker kit with built-in amp' from Argos?

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andrewducker December 14 2012, 11:31:50 UTC
I'd love to see that too. They do it with cheap cables sometimes, but not with cheap amps.

I came across the link because I was discussing cheaper hifi systems with a friend, and saying I could put together a _good_ system for about £500, and wouldn't spend more than that for the home - but I did make the point that you could get all-in-one 5.1 systems for about £300, and 2.1 systems for £200, and you can go even cheaper than that.

To _my_ ears, the really cheap systems do end up sounding tinny and distort easily. But I've not done any blind listening tests.

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philmophlegm December 14 2012, 11:48:05 UTC
Yeah, that's probably where I get to on this (although more from home cinema than music). I can produce anecdotal evidence of what looks and sounds better to me and what seems to make little difference ( ... )

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andrewducker December 14 2012, 11:51:26 UTC
Yeah, I love Richer Sounds.

I got my AV amp based on "It has 3 HDMI inputs and will convert Component in to HDMI out".

And I am totally with you on cables. Comet and suchlike were a massive ripoff for HDMI cables, when the Amazon basics range is cheap and works perfectly well.

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philmophlegm December 14 2012, 12:12:52 UTC
But to be fair to the high street retailers, they have worked to educate people that for example HDMI > SCART. I remember seeing a friend's new plasma screen telly and being shocked by how fuzzy the Sky guide looked on it (because clearly satellite TV picture quality shouldn't depend on how close you are to the aerial...). Then I looked round the back and saw that his £1,500 TV was connected to his Sky box by a free SCART cable ( ... )

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andrewducker December 14 2012, 13:24:22 UTC
Yeah, I've had two dodgy incredibly cheap cables that would just fall out, but once I discovered Amazon Basics I was very happy:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/feature.html?ie=UTF8&docId=1000355113&plgroup=4

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naath December 14 2012, 13:57:13 UTC
stay in better> yes, it's usually worth checking whether the very cheap thing has a failure mode not directly associated with the thing-it-is-for. So, yeah, you can get a good sound out of this cable but *only if it stays plugged in*; this amp is pretty decent as an amp, but it's only got three buttons to control it with and half of the time they don't respond to pressing.

Even though I'm crap at audio stuff I want a cable that stays plugged in :-p

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naath December 14 2012, 13:52:47 UTC
I think the flaws in really crappy kit are more ... obvious. Like the radio-alarm I own that has an audible humming noise when it's off :-p

I would like the reviews of cheap audio kit to be, well, written by non-audiophiles. Even when I can hear the differences they talk about I don't always *care* but sometimes I do (the humming noise was very annoying in an ALARM CLOCK because it hummmmed at me all night).

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philmophlegm December 14 2012, 20:53:14 UTC
Yes, I can see how that might be annoying...

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octopoid_horror December 14 2012, 23:47:26 UTC
I wonder what percentage of self-identifying audiophiles have good enough hearing to actually be able to discern the difference in quality that their equipment supposedly gives.

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andrewducker December 16 2012, 16:56:20 UTC
Well, the blind listening tests should be able to give you some idea of that :->

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octopoid_horror December 16 2012, 17:01:21 UTC
I guess I wasn't clear - I just find the idea of people who describe themselves as audiophiles and spend thousands on cables and whatever to have crap hearing and not realise it. It'd be like me buying a top-of-the-line gaming mouse that costs over £100 when I have shitty hand-eye coordination.

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andrewducker December 16 2012, 17:02:11 UTC
Well, yeah. Which is why blind listening tests that show that most of them can't tell the difference are illuminating!

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