Occupy
The Occupy movement are apparently angry. I’m not entirely sure why. After all they’re living rent free in a public space near you.
That’s your public space, paid for with your tax/rate Dollars/Euros/Pounds etc. In most cases they’re using the public facilities again provided by your hard earned dosh, or in the ultimate irony they’re abusing their ( Read more... )
That’s your public space, paid for with your tax/rate Dollars/Euros/Pounds etc. In most cases they’re using the public facilities again provided by your hard earned dosh, or in the ultimate irony they’re abusing their ( Read more... )
It's not true that the Occupy movement is "squatting." They've got homes. They're there in a public demonstration of outrage.
It's not true that it's undefined and inchoate. Anything but. It's a protest against criminals getting away with their crimes:
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-people-vs-goldman-sachs-20110511
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/blogs/taibblog/evil-corporate-tax-holiday-deal-still-alive-20110804
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/blogs/taibblog/document-shredding-why-secs-defense-wont-fly-20110819
Hell, just peruse Matt Taibbi's blog:
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/blogs/taibblog/
The people who borrowed against inflated equity values to support unsustainable lifestyles are just as culpable as the "Evil corporations inc."
This is a particularly pernicious lie. Were there people who borrowed as you described? Sure. And they could all be taken out in one bus crash.
Most of the "toxic assets" aren't actually toxic. Those mortgages are primarily still being paid, even though the loans were made to people unqualified for them. But the thing is, the loans were made by financial experts who told the recipients, who were truck drivers and grocery store clerks and gardners and warehousemen, that they could support those loans.
Your doctor tells you what's good for your health, you don't overrule him. He's the expert. Your lawyer tells you how to avoid liability, you don't argue. He's the expert. Well, your banker tells you you can and should buy a house through his bank, he's the expert you've hired to manage your finances. If you're not going to trust his advice, what's the point?
And the experts trusted to watch over the financial well-being of thousands and thousands of people robbed them blind and hung them out to dry.
That, my friend, is why those members of the public are making entirely appropriate use of public spaces that are as much theirs as yours and mine, and well they should.
Because the thieves that did them and you and me and the whole world dirty -- Greece? Hello! -- not only got away with it, they got a prize for it.
And that is why the people are peacable assembling to seek redress for their grievances.
ETA: http://nymag.com/news/frank-rich/class-war-2011-10/
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That's one big bus crash across most of the United states. Unless you're suggesting that the laws of supply and demand were suspended in the worlds largest free economy for the last two decades.
In a dark continent on the other side of the Atlantic I knew that a crash was inevitable five years ago.
I'm not suggesting that Banks in your part of the world weren't irresponsible, they were, and they were allowed to be so by lax legislation.
HOWEVER people need to accept their proportion of the blame.
Root of Greece problems lie in the opposite of rampant capitalism, it lies in the lack of productivity in the welfare state.
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You reply: That's one big bus crash across most of the United states. Unless you're suggesting that the laws of supply and demand were suspended in the worlds largest free economy for the last two decades.
No, you're missing my point. I'm being facetious with the single bus crash, but the vast majority of what are being classified as "toxic assets" were not irresponsibly "borrowed against inflated equity values to support unsustainable lifestyles." They were borrowed in good faith based on deliberate, predatory lies by corrupt loan officers of corrupt corporations that were deliberately making bad loans so they could bet against them.
There was a genuinely tiny percentage of these mortgages taken out by would-be get-rich-quick speculators and losers who just up and decided to buy houses they couldn't afford. The overwhelming majority were mortgages taken out by people who were being told, much to their very happy surprise, that they could afford to buy a home, that they could sustain that lifestyle. (Which isn't, by the way, some outlandish Hollywood "Parties and Booze" fantasy, but the simple promise of America, that if you work hard and play by hte rules, you can have a home to live in.) And they were told this by experts they were supposed to be able to trust.
If you wanted to line up all the people who knowingly "borrowed against inflated equity values to support unsustainable lifestyles" and slap them acrss the face, one by one, with a haddock, it wouldn't be a life's work, like Wowbagger the Infinitely Prolonged, who set out to insult everone in the universe, in alphabetical order. You could get it done in a few days.
The great mass of the people who took out those loans did so in good faith based on, not mere negligence, but actual criminal conspiracy by banks and mortgage companies. And none of those has faced the criminal charges they so richly deserve, and the government agencies that are supposed to regulate them have actively colluded to prevent any of the criminals from being punished.
And that is what the Occupy movement is all about.
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"All of us here in America should believe, and I think we do, that we should be, as I mentioned, a nation of owners. Owning something is freedom, as far as I'm concerned. It's part of a free society. And ownership of a home helps bring stability to neighborhoods. You own your home in a neighborhood, you have more interest in how your neighborhood feels, looks, whether it's safe or not. It brings pride to people, it's a part of an asset-based to society. It helps people build up their own individual portfolio, provides an opportunity, if need be, for a mom or a dad to leave something to their child. It's a part of -- it's of being a -- it's a part of -- an important part of America
...Low interest rates, low inflation are very important foundations for economic growth. The idea of encouraging new homeownership and the money that will be circulated as a result of people purchasing homes will mean people are more likely to find a job in America. This project not only is good for the soul of the country, it's good for the pocketbook of the country, as well.
To open up the doors of homeownership there are some barriers, and I want to talk about four that need to be overcome. First, down payments. A lot of folks can't make a down payment. They may be qualified. They may desire to buy a home, but they don't have the money to make a down payment. I think if you were to talk to a lot of families that are desirous to have a home, they would tell you that the down payment is the hurdle that they can't cross. And one way to address that is to have the federal government participate.
..The other thing Kirbyjon told me, which I really appreciate, is you don't have to have a lousy home for first-time home buyers. If you put your mind to it, the first-time home buyer, the low-income home buyer can have just as nice a house as anybody else. "
GWB 2002
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Collectively America & others consumed more than they earned.
It's about taking responsibility, it's about saying "Wow! In retrospect those were pretty stupid decisions.
In order to correct the situation I need to take a little fiscal pain.
Occupy by your description is about finding someone else to blame.
Then as Occupy went viral the who to blame and what to blame them for changed turning the whole thing into a circus.
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It's about taking responsibility,
Marc, this is, literally, the equivalent of telling a teenaged girl who's been drugged and date-raped and found herself pregnant, "Intentionally or not, you did have sex. It's about taking responsibility."
You're blaming the victims. It's dumb, and worse than that, it's mean. You're not some petty little bitch. You're better than this.
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This is more like a group of girls who all bedded the same charming football jock and caught something nasty.
All consenting adults and a [i]good[/i] time was had by all.
The jock should be held to account.
Each girl should be held to account.
Everyone needs to take their (painful) shots.
(The idiot (GWB) who prevented the distribution of free condoms should be lynched)
If people don't accept their responsibilities then they end up advocating a nanny state and abdicating their rights.
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Hence the "drugged" part of the comparison: They were unable to give competent consent because they were deceived.
Not consenting adults having a good time: victims who were being screwed over hard and left bleeding.
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Symptoms arise later
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If someone tells you something that you know is not true and you follow it then you are an idiot. Even if mortgage brokers lied, and a great many did, people still knew they couldn't afford it.
Even more importantly just before the crash the U.S. AS A WHOLE had a negative savings rate because people were using their houses equity and other forms of credit to live beyond their means and then it bit them in the ass.
But, of cours most people prefer to react emotionally to such subjects rather than have to deal with facts.
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