The first person to correctly guess why I like this piece gets a lollipop. Strawberry, apple and blueberry, all mixed. Red, green and blue. If you take the lolly off the pop and spin it fast enough it will become invisible. Right.
Not knowing your personal tastes or interests, I cann't wager a guess as to why you fancy this piece of art. It is a rather interesting piece to pick, I must say. A man, hiding his face behind an apple. I wonder what the symbolism is there? Why does the man hide? Is there something he doesn't want to see, or does he not want to be seen by someone? What could he be hiding?
My interpretation would be the apple is symbolic of sin, and the man hiding behind the apple is trying to hide behind his sins. He is a proper, upstanding gentleman- his suit and his hat, and his straight posture suggest that- and he...has something to hide. Shame. Guilt, perhaps. He cannot face the world as he is now...
And yet the apple is not only in his face, it is in ours. Would you say that, were the apple to represent sin, it is possible that the man is flaunting his so-called sins, rather than hiding them?
Perhaps. However, if I wanted to flaunt my sins, I would not hold them in front of my face, but in my hand. I'd want the world to see who those sins belonged to.
Why would you care what the world thought of you? Does openly revealing your sins to others make you strong, or does being indifferent to what others think imply that you are beyond the influence of others' opinions on your behavior?
I'd argue the former. So many people try to hide their sins, their shames, that to see one who openly, boldly proclaims his sins would make him strong, if only in contrast to the weakness of the masses.
I do not remember sending such a message. I presumed we were speaking hypothetically; as it is, I hide my greatest sins behind a mask. There are things I am ashamed of and would not wish to ever expose to the world. Going with my previous argument, would that not mean I consider my own self weak? Perhaps I am but envious of those who have the strength to own up to their own faults?
Suppose those who trusted you simply assessed you to the best of their ability. They simply did not assess you well enough by considering that it was possible for your motives to change such that you worked against them.
Is it your fault for your motives changing or theirs for failing to take this possibility into account?
Is that what trust is about, assessing people as though they are tools? To trust means you do not need to take into account that it is possible for one's motives to change in such a fashion. Such an assessment: that is, taking into consideration that one may change in such a way that one works against them goes directly against the whole idea of trust.
...it would be my "fault", if fault is the correct word. I could not consider it their fault if I failed their trust in me. But I think it depends on the betrayer, whether there is fault or not. The betrayed will feel it is their fault for misplacing their trust, while if the one doing the betraying did not begin the relationship with the intention of betraying the others would feel the fault is their own. However, the betrayer may have begun the relationship with the intention of gaining their trust only to break it in the end, in which case the only one feeling the guilt for the betrayal is the one who was betrayed.
[Screened to...//Unhackable]zer0_controlMarch 14 2008, 06:53:06 UTC
My..."case", as you say? ...it's a long story, so I'll make it shorter. Because of something stupid I said, my sister murdered my best friend. And because of something that happened before that, using a power I no longer control...he simultaneously killed her.
To anyone else, it would easily seem like a lovers' suicide, as I believe they were...close. Very close, and very dear to me and each other...and I caused them to kill each other.
My interpretation would be the apple is symbolic of sin, and the man hiding behind the apple is trying to hide behind his sins. He is a proper, upstanding gentleman- his suit and his hat, and his straight posture suggest that- and he...has something to hide. Shame. Guilt, perhaps. He cannot face the world as he is now...
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Why would you care what the world thought of you? Does openly revealing your sins to others make you strong, or does being indifferent to what others think imply that you are beyond the influence of others' opinions on your behavior?
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I brought this up in response to your use of "the masses" in your previous reply.
Interesting that you would tell me you hide, then.
...What do you consider to be the greatest sin?
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Well, I do mean it rather literally.
Betrayal. To betray those who trust you most is the greatest sin.
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Suppose those who trusted you simply assessed you to the best of their ability. They simply did not assess you well enough by considering that it was possible for your motives to change such that you worked against them.
Is it your fault for your motives changing or theirs for failing to take this possibility into account?
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...it would be my "fault", if fault is the correct word. I could not consider it their fault if I failed their trust in me. But I think it depends on the betrayer, whether there is fault or not. The betrayed will feel it is their fault for misplacing their trust, while if the one doing the betraying did not begin the relationship with the intention of betraying the others would feel the fault is their own. However, the betrayer may have begun the relationship with the intention of gaining their trust only to break it in the end, in which case the only one feeling the guilt for the betrayal is the one who was betrayed.
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If there was a way to regain their trust would you try to find it?
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...the worst part is, they don't even realize I betrayed them...they died. And they never knew it was me...
B-but he is here now...he's alive, here....
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...
Are you willing to share the details of your case?
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To anyone else, it would easily seem like a lovers' suicide, as I believe they were...close. Very close, and very dear to me and each other...and I caused them to kill each other.
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- You feel guilt for betraying these people
- The betrayal seems to involve a) a power you once controlled, and/or b) something you said.
I will be blunt.
What is this power, and how did controlling it once allow you to betray?
Or...
What did you say? Did you lie to your sister hence betraying her? Did you provoke her unnecessarily?
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