(no subject)
I've left several online feminist communities in my time, for mostly the same reason. The discussion exits the realm of reasoned discussion and enters the land of radical dick swinging. Most notably, I was once accused of being a rape apologist because I suggested some guy selling a t-shirt with a mildly offensive joke shouldn't be *legally disallowed* from selling his wares.
I recently stayed out of a discussion which was headed in that same "more-feminist-than-zie" conversation. The issue at hand was a blog post, which was actually not that well written and full of straw men. The message itself was solid. The blogger was talking about "prescriptivist feminists", those lucky souls who have definitive knowledge of what is and is not a feminist act. The author gave wearing high heeled shoes as an example of something that is considered "anti-feminist". It's a pretty poor example. But she did go on to explain that dogmatic beliefs about what is and isn't feminist is pretty unhelpful. I agree.
The discussion in the comments was immediately hostile. "If something is against equality, it's anti-feminist. No matter what. You wouldn't say that someone who supported rape was a feminist under any circumstance" What a helpful statement. Some people are just constitutionally incapable of nuanced analysis. Why is it people insist on dealing in absolutes? And throwing around terms like 'equality' assuming it has a single definition and execution.
Anyway, I sort of wanted to speak on this topic a little further. First, why is it feminists can't seem to have a discussion without shouting at eachother for being sexist or not radical enough or whatever?
Second, What IS the deal with prescriptive femininism? Here are some things that I've been told by various femininists about things I'm not supposed to do or like or support:
-Transgender, because it reinforces the idea that gender is innate.
-BDSM, because playing with submission is BAD unless the guy is being submissive and then its OKAY
-Be in a hetero marriage because it's PATRIARCHY
I think feminism is something I'll never give up on, but I am often tempted to give up on feminists.
I recently stayed out of a discussion which was headed in that same "more-feminist-than-zie" conversation. The issue at hand was a blog post, which was actually not that well written and full of straw men. The message itself was solid. The blogger was talking about "prescriptivist feminists", those lucky souls who have definitive knowledge of what is and is not a feminist act. The author gave wearing high heeled shoes as an example of something that is considered "anti-feminist". It's a pretty poor example. But she did go on to explain that dogmatic beliefs about what is and isn't feminist is pretty unhelpful. I agree.
The discussion in the comments was immediately hostile. "If something is against equality, it's anti-feminist. No matter what. You wouldn't say that someone who supported rape was a feminist under any circumstance" What a helpful statement. Some people are just constitutionally incapable of nuanced analysis. Why is it people insist on dealing in absolutes? And throwing around terms like 'equality' assuming it has a single definition and execution.
Anyway, I sort of wanted to speak on this topic a little further. First, why is it feminists can't seem to have a discussion without shouting at eachother for being sexist or not radical enough or whatever?
Second, What IS the deal with prescriptive femininism? Here are some things that I've been told by various femininists about things I'm not supposed to do or like or support:
-Transgender, because it reinforces the idea that gender is innate.
-BDSM, because playing with submission is BAD unless the guy is being submissive and then its OKAY
-Be in a hetero marriage because it's PATRIARCHY
I think feminism is something I'll never give up on, but I am often tempted to give up on feminists.