Sorrow and Rapture Response
The coming of the Christ. The saving of all those who are faithful. The damning of all those unworthy to serve Him in eternal service. This is what a significant number of Christians believe will occur. (Maybe some Christians do, but you have misinterpreted a lot.) How can they believe that a being, a God perhaps, in all of its *infinite* wisdom could decide what is worthy of eternal life and ultimate salvation, or eternal damnation and suffering. (we decide on our own - free will, you know) I find this line of thought to be rather disturbing.
(Yes, and so do I. But again, you have misinterpreted what you have heard) Now, this is entirely my own opinion, so if my line of thought isn’t in agreement with yours, then I apologize. You may criticize my words, but know that I only write this in an attempt t understand how such blind faith works. (And I will try to help you understand.) I’m not saying that your way of thinking is flawed (thanks!); I’m merely saying that I myself don’t think that way on this subject. To me, a supreme being wouldn’t think it has the power to decide something so significant.
(First, you are defining God within human limitations. Second: He is, after all, the Creator, so He does have the power.) I would think it would be with the understanding that nothing can determine such things other than the individual. (Absolutely right! It is up to the individual!) If someone wants to be saved, then to me they have a chance (yes!). I don’t think some higher being will go "You can’t be saved because you didn’t do this!" (you are again trying to define God within your human experience) I don’t think that’s what it would do. I think it would allow people to live out their lives watching them if not doing anything at all, letting them be the masters of their fate as it were. (Right again.) I myself think certain crimes are too high to ever be forgiven, but I don’t think a supreme being would see it that way. (this is a major debate.) I think that it would see every event as something to learn and grow from, to complete yourself as an individual, not something that causes all life after to be meaningless. (Yes again.) I also don’t think that a Supreme Being would want to be worship. (But you don’t think like a Supreme Being. And He wants our love first. He wants us to “seek His face.”) Whether or not we were made by one entity is yet to be proven, but I feel that if we were then why would it want us to worship it? (You can’t think like God) Does a parent want its children to worship them? (depends on the parent) Love them perhaps, or accept them as having somewhat more power over them, but far from worshiping. Christians constantly say that we are the children of God and that He made us in his image, if so, then we would in fact be his progeny, meaning to me that we are destined to live by our own rules and our own thoughts, not preparing for death. (Wait a second: We are His creations, but not automatically His children. We become His children by “adoption.” The Way to the Father is through the Son, Jesus.) If all life was simply about preparing for death (no, preparing for eternal life), then I think existence would be a little bit different. I think we all live to experience life, not to prepare for either eternal damnation or salvation (whoops!). I don’t believe anyone can do any one thing to warrant eternal salvation. (No, you can never earn it. It is a gift from God) Sure you can help lots of people, stop wars, feed the hungry, cure the sick, but if you think about it that’s what people are supposed to do normally. (Yes, we should) We’re social creatures after all, and the betterment of the pack should always be high on out lists. (uh, no, actually our natural condition is more Me Me Me) So, when Christians or other religious practitioners state that what I am doing is a sin, or wrong, or will condemn me to hell, I ask them why they think it’s a horrible thing. (There are only 10 commandments! And if you really simplify, there are only 2. That’s not so hard) If things were so horrible that they would cause us unimaginable pain and suffering later, I don’t think they would be here. (free will again: the difference between a Mother Theresa and a Charles Manson) No parent wants to see their child suffer so much, they want to see us make our own choice, fall and then rise up ourselves once again. So, under the thought that we are Gods children, and he loves all of us, then why would He have such a horrible place as Hell? (Hell is not a place, per se; it is the state of being permanently separated from God. He doesn’t want you there either) I think that is completely absurd if you think about that. And also, what parent truly wishes for their child to stay with them forever? Do they not want them to go out into the world and find who they are and do what they, not the parents, want to do? (sorry, but we are back to trying to make God like people) Now of course they’re exceptions to this, but the majority of parents, good parents, would say that they want their kids to live life how they want to. (Actually, no, I want my kids to live the way I know will bring them the happiness they deserve. Living a self-centered life, always focused in on one’s self is not what I wish for any of my kids. I have been parenting for nigh on 30 years, and I promise you, most parents want this.) Which makes sense to me, and I think would also make sense to most sensible people. But O NO! I’m wrong, God exists. (YES) And He has a plan for us all (OH YES!! “For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the LORD, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future. - Jeremiah 29:11) and he loves us all so much that he wants us to be with him forever (“I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also.” John 14:3), and if we cant do what He wants specifically, then we’re no longer sought after and are discarded unto Hell. (nope, we put ourselves in Hell) Still make sense to anyone? I think not. But, this is just my thought on the matter. I think its sad to put so much faith into something that probably just wants you to be you. (this is such a humanistic approach! “I’m OK, You’re OK.” Well, we are not OK, and to pound that into our heads is wrong, wrong, wrong. We are miserable little petty self-centered creatures from the get-go. It’s true. I tell you, telling children that they are perfectly OK the way they are, go out and be yourself is wrong. If we are all good and wonderful, explain rape, murder, war, failed relationships, extortion, peeping Toms, people who prey on children and old people - This is our free will at work, all of us just trying to be “who we are.” Yes, we have a God who loves us unconditionally, and invites us to seek Him - He even pursues us, woos us, but He wants us to choose Him willingly) . I also feel that living life to prepare for death is a sad, (well, yeah) and empty experience. (I am hardly preparing for Death! I am looking forward to eternal life with the God of Creation! And if that sounds sad and empty, I am sad for you.)You miss out on so much things that way, so many potential memories that could help shape who it is that you are “destined” to become. (I haven’t missed a thing, thank you very much. Do you think Christians just pack themselves up in bubble wrap and wait for the rapture?) That’s another thing that kinda erks me, why is it that all monotheistic religious persons seem to think that there’s a specific plan for us? (because it says so in the Bible?) If a supreme being were to do that, then where would choice come into play? Why make something you know all the answers to. (well, He is omnipotent, it’s hard not to know the answers) There’s no fun in that. So I don’t think that’s the correct way to go about thinking. Again, this is only what I think. If everything was predetermined, then what would the point in life be? There would be no point. (exactly! That’s why we were given free will. Listen closely: God knows what is going to happen. That is different from predetermining what will happen. He enjoys the novelty of our responses. Haven’t you ever said to a good friend, “I knew you would say that.”) Your purpose then simply becomes that; the purpose you have is to fulfill the purpose that someone else set for you, which to me doesn’t seem to fit. (and you are right) People have too many choices about what they can do for that. Life is an adventure, and I believe that no one, not even God almighty, knows just what is going to happen with you. (Yay! But the twist here is, He is always ready to take our mistakes and work them to the good. God makes the best of everything) I will conclude my rant with this thought; why have such blind faith in something that one can never truly know unless you accept many variables, when you can just live life how you feel it should be lived and hope for the best when kingdom comes?
What else will I put my blind faith in? Myself? Hardly. I am weak. I would rather put my faith in the Creator God, Who loves me. No one on this planet loves me the way He does. I am blessed, I have seen His work, I have felt His touch, I can go to Him any time, and be immersed in His Spirit.
I am not hemmed in by random rules and regulation. I am not restricted by my God. Rather I am set free from this world and all of its imperfections and pain.
Why does everyone believe that Christians aren’t having any fun?
Why does everyone believe I (or any other Christian) want to condemn them?
Don’t you understand? I am looking forward to eternal life with the Great Engineer, the Divine Creator! I can’t think of anything more wonderful.
AND! AND! AND! I want to see all the people I have loved and care about be there in Heaven with me, too! That means you!
(Yes, and so do I. But again, you have misinterpreted what you have heard) Now, this is entirely my own opinion, so if my line of thought isn’t in agreement with yours, then I apologize. You may criticize my words, but know that I only write this in an attempt t understand how such blind faith works. (And I will try to help you understand.) I’m not saying that your way of thinking is flawed (thanks!); I’m merely saying that I myself don’t think that way on this subject. To me, a supreme being wouldn’t think it has the power to decide something so significant.
(First, you are defining God within human limitations. Second: He is, after all, the Creator, so He does have the power.) I would think it would be with the understanding that nothing can determine such things other than the individual. (Absolutely right! It is up to the individual!) If someone wants to be saved, then to me they have a chance (yes!). I don’t think some higher being will go "You can’t be saved because you didn’t do this!" (you are again trying to define God within your human experience) I don’t think that’s what it would do. I think it would allow people to live out their lives watching them if not doing anything at all, letting them be the masters of their fate as it were. (Right again.) I myself think certain crimes are too high to ever be forgiven, but I don’t think a supreme being would see it that way. (this is a major debate.) I think that it would see every event as something to learn and grow from, to complete yourself as an individual, not something that causes all life after to be meaningless. (Yes again.) I also don’t think that a Supreme Being would want to be worship. (But you don’t think like a Supreme Being. And He wants our love first. He wants us to “seek His face.”) Whether or not we were made by one entity is yet to be proven, but I feel that if we were then why would it want us to worship it? (You can’t think like God) Does a parent want its children to worship them? (depends on the parent) Love them perhaps, or accept them as having somewhat more power over them, but far from worshiping. Christians constantly say that we are the children of God and that He made us in his image, if so, then we would in fact be his progeny, meaning to me that we are destined to live by our own rules and our own thoughts, not preparing for death. (Wait a second: We are His creations, but not automatically His children. We become His children by “adoption.” The Way to the Father is through the Son, Jesus.) If all life was simply about preparing for death (no, preparing for eternal life), then I think existence would be a little bit different. I think we all live to experience life, not to prepare for either eternal damnation or salvation (whoops!). I don’t believe anyone can do any one thing to warrant eternal salvation. (No, you can never earn it. It is a gift from God) Sure you can help lots of people, stop wars, feed the hungry, cure the sick, but if you think about it that’s what people are supposed to do normally. (Yes, we should) We’re social creatures after all, and the betterment of the pack should always be high on out lists. (uh, no, actually our natural condition is more Me Me Me) So, when Christians or other religious practitioners state that what I am doing is a sin, or wrong, or will condemn me to hell, I ask them why they think it’s a horrible thing. (There are only 10 commandments! And if you really simplify, there are only 2. That’s not so hard) If things were so horrible that they would cause us unimaginable pain and suffering later, I don’t think they would be here. (free will again: the difference between a Mother Theresa and a Charles Manson) No parent wants to see their child suffer so much, they want to see us make our own choice, fall and then rise up ourselves once again. So, under the thought that we are Gods children, and he loves all of us, then why would He have such a horrible place as Hell? (Hell is not a place, per se; it is the state of being permanently separated from God. He doesn’t want you there either) I think that is completely absurd if you think about that. And also, what parent truly wishes for their child to stay with them forever? Do they not want them to go out into the world and find who they are and do what they, not the parents, want to do? (sorry, but we are back to trying to make God like people) Now of course they’re exceptions to this, but the majority of parents, good parents, would say that they want their kids to live life how they want to. (Actually, no, I want my kids to live the way I know will bring them the happiness they deserve. Living a self-centered life, always focused in on one’s self is not what I wish for any of my kids. I have been parenting for nigh on 30 years, and I promise you, most parents want this.) Which makes sense to me, and I think would also make sense to most sensible people. But O NO! I’m wrong, God exists. (YES) And He has a plan for us all (OH YES!! “For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the LORD, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future. - Jeremiah 29:11) and he loves us all so much that he wants us to be with him forever (“I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also.” John 14:3), and if we cant do what He wants specifically, then we’re no longer sought after and are discarded unto Hell. (nope, we put ourselves in Hell) Still make sense to anyone? I think not. But, this is just my thought on the matter. I think its sad to put so much faith into something that probably just wants you to be you. (this is such a humanistic approach! “I’m OK, You’re OK.” Well, we are not OK, and to pound that into our heads is wrong, wrong, wrong. We are miserable little petty self-centered creatures from the get-go. It’s true. I tell you, telling children that they are perfectly OK the way they are, go out and be yourself is wrong. If we are all good and wonderful, explain rape, murder, war, failed relationships, extortion, peeping Toms, people who prey on children and old people - This is our free will at work, all of us just trying to be “who we are.” Yes, we have a God who loves us unconditionally, and invites us to seek Him - He even pursues us, woos us, but He wants us to choose Him willingly) . I also feel that living life to prepare for death is a sad, (well, yeah) and empty experience. (I am hardly preparing for Death! I am looking forward to eternal life with the God of Creation! And if that sounds sad and empty, I am sad for you.)You miss out on so much things that way, so many potential memories that could help shape who it is that you are “destined” to become. (I haven’t missed a thing, thank you very much. Do you think Christians just pack themselves up in bubble wrap and wait for the rapture?) That’s another thing that kinda erks me, why is it that all monotheistic religious persons seem to think that there’s a specific plan for us? (because it says so in the Bible?) If a supreme being were to do that, then where would choice come into play? Why make something you know all the answers to. (well, He is omnipotent, it’s hard not to know the answers) There’s no fun in that. So I don’t think that’s the correct way to go about thinking. Again, this is only what I think. If everything was predetermined, then what would the point in life be? There would be no point. (exactly! That’s why we were given free will. Listen closely: God knows what is going to happen. That is different from predetermining what will happen. He enjoys the novelty of our responses. Haven’t you ever said to a good friend, “I knew you would say that.”) Your purpose then simply becomes that; the purpose you have is to fulfill the purpose that someone else set for you, which to me doesn’t seem to fit. (and you are right) People have too many choices about what they can do for that. Life is an adventure, and I believe that no one, not even God almighty, knows just what is going to happen with you. (Yay! But the twist here is, He is always ready to take our mistakes and work them to the good. God makes the best of everything) I will conclude my rant with this thought; why have such blind faith in something that one can never truly know unless you accept many variables, when you can just live life how you feel it should be lived and hope for the best when kingdom comes?
What else will I put my blind faith in? Myself? Hardly. I am weak. I would rather put my faith in the Creator God, Who loves me. No one on this planet loves me the way He does. I am blessed, I have seen His work, I have felt His touch, I can go to Him any time, and be immersed in His Spirit.
I am not hemmed in by random rules and regulation. I am not restricted by my God. Rather I am set free from this world and all of its imperfections and pain.
Why does everyone believe that Christians aren’t having any fun?
Why does everyone believe I (or any other Christian) want to condemn them?
Don’t you understand? I am looking forward to eternal life with the Great Engineer, the Divine Creator! I can’t think of anything more wonderful.
AND! AND! AND! I want to see all the people I have loved and care about be there in Heaven with me, too! That means you!