I've recently got into a very nasty argument about this to the point I was ran out of a community. I would like to discuss/rant about it
( Read more... )
I think multi-ethnic, multi-racial, multi-religious, interclass, bisexual, any type of puralistic identity people have a hard time fitting into any ONE group. It is mostly because we can never completely understand or be understood by any single dimensional identity group. Trying to fit in can often be a waste of time, even with other bi-racial people because we all have different experiences and our experiences are often very effected by our experience of class, sexuality, and gender.
As far as my experience goes I try to empathize with the experience of darker skinned folks, and understand my privilege as a lighter skinned person while at the same time honoring my own experience as a person who's race is quite often denied, or rejected in the form of non-inclusion. But I do know I am privileged, I am not privileged because I am hit on by darker men, or because people think I am safe, it is because I benefit from my skin color, and my spectrum of choice is wider within society in many ways compared to someone who may be less racial ambiguous than I am.
Internalized oppression is a big deal. Hating yourself and jealousy based on self abasing concepts is a hard thing to deal with, and although you can leave a social circle that doesn't honor you a person can never leave their skin behind. When I am accused of being somehow wrong for my skin color, I just try and remember all the pain that those comments come from, and try and make a point to say I am okay with me, and that I am okay with who the person talking to me is, looks and all, but I am not okay with being attacked.
A part of this discussion feels like that age old "black people are the most racist people out there" thing. And I guess it looks that way when you are the one that is getting picked on. But darker skinned people are understandably threatened by privileged light skinned folks. We have choices they might not have, and we have the power to used them, especially against darker folks.
More on privilegeneverguessedJuly 15 2009, 23:49:23 UTC
And, not only do I benefit from my skin color on a day to day basis but also regarding up-bringing etc. I know that having a white adult representative parent through my child encouraged teachers, and other influential people in my life to give me preference. I know that this preference has been a building block in my world view and self confidence, I also know that it has informed my ability to connect with other white authority figures more comfortably in many cases than those who don't have white parents, or preference within a mostly white group of authorities (be they teachers, coach's, babysitters, etc, etc) and down the line, simply being light skinned and having a white mother has given me a lot of benefits that I might take for granted.
Yes, I have experienced discrimination, yes, I have a different kind of racial experience, and social experience that white women who would otherwise be identical, but I can pretty surely say that in comparison to someone who would be otherwise and identical and darker I have privilege.
I have been trying to explain the system of privilege a lot of white friends of mine, and a big part of that is owning my privilege because the first thing that people say to me is "But you are not THAT dark!" which can close a conversation. I think it helps that I can own my experiences with discrimination, and my experiences on privilege, so that people can understand that I can understand the experience of being a victim and a perpetrator of racism. Believe me, it surprises me how often I AM or feel like prepetrator of racism against darker skinned girlfriends because I have so internalized a perspective that is often called "Ignorant" .
I love to be who I am, but I know it is a fine line that I walk. If anything, I have found people of color to be more supportive and understanding of my experience. Usually with a white audience this type of conversation gets very touchy and personal, with people who have racial experiences closer to mine we have a very easy time getting a long an thinking more theoretically.
Although darker folks with two black parents might be expected to understand the mulatto experience, but what merits that expectation. People with the experience as a racial minority can connect on that level, having a shared history can be another connection, but really getting or understanding what it means to have a foot in some way, and identify in some way with both sides of the racial divide is something any person who views themselves as racially singular would have a hard time understanding.
Light skinned people benefit from the oppression of dark skinned people.
BTW. I feel bad for Alek being put as the poster-girl for dark-skinned beauty as defined by the white culture via fashion madness. Power is the ability to prescribe beauty for ourselves, I don't recognize any of these folks in the media. I wanna see people making their own media, and their own standards of beauty!
Re: More on privilegetalking_appleJuly 16 2009, 00:33:04 UTC
I've always been used to being the victim of racism (because I grew up in a racist town), so I never thought of myself as the perpetrator. But I understand where it's coming from now. I guess I don't fully understand my privilege yet.
I also found people of color supportive of me too, which was why I was taken aback by the community in which I posted. I wasn't expecting to be attacked. I guess I just need to realize that "fine line" that you were talking about.
Haha, I would love to have "talking_apple TV!" The sad thing is, I'm majoring in journalism, so I know all too well what the media thinks "beauty" is.
Yeah, I'm really happy you posted, too. You've enlightened me on some things.
It's understandable why some black people are emotional about this. I never thought that I could use my lighter skin against them. I never want to, so I understand why they feel threatened. It's hard to stand the backlash of their emotions, but I understand where they come from. They have a right to be angry.
It's unfair that American society has this "spectrum of color." I've received backlash from both white and black folks because of it, for different reasons. You're right -- racial ambiguity does mean more privilege.
I'm happy you got something out of my responses. I live in Finland now, and believe me color-ism as an offshoot of racism is everywhere, the USA is just more concentrated. It's just part of the whit supremicist scheme, which has long been globalized thanks to imperialism, and the slave trade. Not to be a downer, but it is good that there are people like us thinking about this stuff, maybe some change will come out of it!
keep on truckin' (lol) Cheers on your media studies. I am an artist and one of my goals is to create work that addresses and redefines race, gender, sexuality, class etc. etc. definitions. This work is really important, and I think multiracial and otherwise pluralistic people can make a big difference because when we have insight we can peek into so many different walks of life while being rooted in a multifaceted experience. Good Luck!
As far as my experience goes I try to empathize with the experience of darker skinned folks, and understand my privilege as a lighter skinned person while at the same time honoring my own experience as a person who's race is quite often denied, or rejected in the form of non-inclusion. But I do know I am privileged, I am not privileged because I am hit on by darker men, or because people think I am safe, it is because I benefit from my skin color, and my spectrum of choice is wider within society in many ways compared to someone who may be less racial ambiguous than I am.
Internalized oppression is a big deal. Hating yourself and jealousy based on self abasing concepts is a hard thing to deal with, and although you can leave a social circle that doesn't honor you a person can never leave their skin behind. When I am accused of being somehow wrong for my skin color, I just try and remember all the pain that those comments come from, and try and make a point to say I am okay with me, and that I am okay with who the person talking to me is, looks and all, but I am not okay with being attacked.
A part of this discussion feels like that age old "black people are the most racist people out there" thing. And I guess it looks that way when you are the one that is getting picked on. But darker skinned people are understandably threatened by privileged light skinned folks. We have choices they might not have, and we have the power to used them, especially against darker folks.
This is big stuff. I'm really happy you posted.
Reply
Yes, I have experienced discrimination, yes, I have a different kind of racial experience, and social experience that white women who would otherwise be identical, but I can pretty surely say that in comparison to someone who would be otherwise and identical and darker I have privilege.
I have been trying to explain the system of privilege a lot of white friends of mine, and a big part of that is owning my privilege because the first thing that people say to me is "But you are not THAT dark!" which can close a conversation. I think it helps that I can own my experiences with discrimination, and my experiences on privilege, so that people can understand that I can understand the experience of being a victim and a perpetrator of racism. Believe me, it surprises me how often I AM or feel like prepetrator of racism against darker skinned girlfriends because I have so internalized a perspective that is often called "Ignorant" .
I love to be who I am, but I know it is a fine line that I walk. If anything, I have found people of color to be more supportive and understanding of my experience. Usually with a white audience this type of conversation gets very touchy and personal, with people who have racial experiences closer to mine we have a very easy time getting a long an thinking more theoretically.
Although darker folks with two black parents might be expected to understand the mulatto experience, but what merits that expectation. People with the experience as a racial minority can connect on that level, having a shared history can be another connection, but really getting or understanding what it means to have a foot in some way, and identify in some way with both sides of the racial divide is something any person who views themselves as racially singular would have a hard time understanding.
Light skinned people benefit from the oppression of dark skinned people.
BTW. I feel bad for Alek being put as the poster-girl for dark-skinned beauty as defined by the white culture via fashion madness. Power is the ability to prescribe beauty for ourselves, I don't recognize any of these folks in the media. I wanna see people making their own media, and their own standards of beauty!
Reply
I also found people of color supportive of me too, which was why I was taken aback by the community in which I posted. I wasn't expecting to be attacked. I guess I just need to realize that "fine line" that you were talking about.
Haha, I would love to have "talking_apple TV!" The sad thing is, I'm majoring in journalism, so I know all too well what the media thinks "beauty" is.
Reply
It's understandable why some black people are emotional about this. I never thought that I could use my lighter skin against them. I never want to, so I understand why they feel threatened. It's hard to stand the backlash of their emotions, but I understand where they come from. They have a right to be angry.
It's unfair that American society has this "spectrum of color." I've received backlash from both white and black folks because of it, for different reasons. You're right -- racial ambiguity does mean more privilege.
Reply
keep on truckin' (lol) Cheers on your media studies. I am an artist and one of my goals is to create work that addresses and redefines race, gender, sexuality, class etc. etc. definitions. This work is really important, and I think multiracial and otherwise pluralistic people can make a big difference because when we have insight we can peek into so many different walks of life while being rooted in a multifaceted experience. Good Luck!
Reply
I will :). Hopefully, I can make some change. I wish you luck on your art. What you're doing sounds great. Keep up the good work!
Reply
Leave a comment